Amazon hiring bar is a joke!

Amazon / Eng Horton
Aug 23, 2018 35 Comments

In Amazon, many L6 TPMs switch to L6 SDM or L6 research scientist without formal interview processes. So people can get into Amazon from easy L6 PM path and become a L6 SDM later. Even many L7 PM can switch to L7 SDM same way! Joke!

The high hiring bar of L6 SDM can be easily bypassed by internal transfer.

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TOP 35 Comments
  • Microsoft GOD!
    Just give it 2-3 years, it's gonna start showing it's effects soon. Bezos needs to get his shit together. He doesn't want to compromise on the quality of goods on his platform, but is ready to compromise the quality on people building that platform. Hmm, that's a recipe for the next eBay.
    Aug 23, 2018 3
    • Amazon / Eng onMyWay
      It’s recoverable. I know a company that’s gone through this phase a couple times.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Microsoft GOD!
      I hope so! Have too much amzn stock, lol
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Oracle O2j2UB
      eBay didn't struggle because of tech, but a business choice to show sellers in the open. Amazon thrives because it feels like the product comes from them directly, not a random and questionable retailer using the platform (doesn't matter if it actually doesn't). They built a universe around e-commerce. Ebay? Just a website.
      Aug 23, 2018
  • Vertivco / Eng Fast Papua
    Please change the title from Hiring to Transfer. Or else you're putting out disinformation.
    Aug 23, 2018 3
    • Amazon / Eng Horton
      OP
      Hiring and internal transfer are related, right? People can bypass the high hiring bar of L6 SDM by becoming a L6 TPM first.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Airbnb / Product Orpheus
      You’re right but hiring generally refers to external candidates
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Vertivco / Eng Fast Papua
      What on Earth are you talking about?
      Aug 23, 2018
  • Amazon ThisGuy!
    That is not a hire, it's an internal transfer.
    I heard some having more thorough interviews when changing job families, but don't know if it is consistent or the norm.
    Aug 23, 2018 3
    • Amazon / Eng Horton
      OP
      There is no bar raiser for internal transfer. In Facebook, it’s impossible for people in different job families to transfer.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Facebook Veal
      BS on FB
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Quora thebumble
      @Horton - ex-Bar Raiser here. Internal loops are set at the discretion of the management as they're the people who are taking the risk. I've BR'ed many internal loops as well as have seen offers without any interviews. This is mostly for cross organization transfers.

      For horizontal transition within team or organization, there are well defined guidelines put in place by the HR whereby a candidate has to perform in a new role for X months before they can jump the job family. The process is 360 and very thorough.

      In this case, it seems that the person who moved indeed did well and HM is ready to take the risk. So there's nothing wrong with it.

      Again, just like how different teams have different bar across Amazon while hiring an external candidate, different candidates up for horizontal move may have to walk through different intensity of fire.
      Aug 23, 2018
  • Amazon GrumpyDad
    These TPM or PM turned SDMs are usually shitty people managers
    Aug 23, 2018 0
  • Amazon lhfdhs
    PM to research scientist? Are you kidding me? The bar for research scientist is the highest. I'm trying to find a way to report this to higher levels
    Aug 23, 2018 6
    • Amazon lhfdhs
      Which org is this? I can find out and report it.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Amazon kams
      How do you know that they don’t have the skills?
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Amazon lhfdhs
      If they had the skills, they would have applied directly for research scientist role from the beginning. They know the bar for research scientist is the highest and knew wouldn't clear the interview.
      If they really had the skills, they wouldn't go that way down to PM.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Amazon kams
      I have seen cases where the candidate was rejected for RS role, joined Amazon as a BIE or PM, developed the RS skillset and moved to a RS role.
      While I understand the loopholes that you are talking about, we should also be aware that skills are not something a person is blessed with, and that they can be developed over time
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Amazon WicH21
      Lhfdhs - Why do you care so much? The bar for Rs is highest is pure bull crap. Also the like someone else said skills are not everyone is born with
      Aug 24, 2018
  • Amazon CarlBezOs
    It has been become much more difficult to make these transitions happen. I agree the bar has lowered and these kind of sketchy things happening. I hope we get it together soon or your predictions might come true
    Aug 23, 2018 5
    • Amazon / Eng Horton
      OP
      I recently know two L7 PM change to L7 SDM in 6 months after joining Amazon! Joke.
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Amazon CarlBezOs
      Thats unfortunate. Everything we are seeing on our end is trying to quell that
      Aug 23, 2018
    • Cisco Go!
      Why would hiring manager even allow that lol
      Aug 24, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng S.Nadella
      @Go! The logic is “if I manage a L7 SDM, it looks more impressive than managing a L7 PM and I’m more likely to be promoted to L8”
      Aug 24, 2018
    • Cisco Go!
      Oh wow, is that how people abuse the system now? Why wouldn't they just hire someone externally who is actually qualified for the job if internal promotion (of someone to L7) is hard...

      Is it b3cauee it is hard to create a new L7 SDM req?
      Aug 24, 2018
  • VMware BobbleHat
    There are also people that do shitty in an interview but can perform extremely well in real work.
    Aug 23, 2018 2
    • Amazon / Eng Horton
      OP
      That’s true! Then we don’t need interview anymore.
      Aug 24, 2018
    • VMware BobbleHat
      If you can pip people as soon as they do shitty work why do you waste time with a error-prone interview process... just hire anyone willing to drink the koolaid and fire whomever you don’t like, anytime you want.
      Aug 24, 2018
  • Amazon / Other $hit$how
    Checkout fintech, none of those idiots belong to tech job family. Finding interview loops is nightmare because none of the L6 SDMs have CS basics.
    Aug 23, 2018 1
    • Amazon gdSe61
      Lol True
      Aug 23, 2018
  • Amazon retards
    Acquisition is worse some really weak employees got L6 and L7, one of the current SDMs didn't write a line of code in his life ever he do not know what is the difference between if and loop statements literally
    Aug 29, 2018 1
    • VMware BobbleHat
      Better promote them to VP
      Aug 29, 2018
  • Amazon fcukg
    In my org I have seen a QAE move to QAM and then to SDM just by playing dirty politics within 1.5 years and he promotes people who basically just maintain some intern projects.
    Aug 25, 2018 1
    • Cisco Go!
      Let me guess...🤔
      Aug 25, 2018

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