Misc.

Dairy Industry cruelty

New monomo
Jan 1

Just got to know the truth, I know I'm late but I'm utterly truly dumbfounded. The torture and suffering there is 100 times worse than death itself. Even in India, cows and buffaloes are not treated this bad afaik. In any possible way, I'm considering giving up dairy products forever. Would love to know your thoughts.

EDIT: For someone who prefers a TLDR, here it is:
- Separating calves from mothers before the moment they're born.
- Mothers crying alone in silence for weeks to meet their babies.
- Killing male calves at 4 months of age
- Continuously impregnating and force-milking female cows that make them wear out at the very point they must have reached their "youth".
- Cutting their lifespan to 5 years where their normal lifespan is 15-20 years.
- Chaining a cow for its lifetime at the same spot.
- Slaughtering cows without any anaesthesia whatsoever, or shooting them in the head otherwise, skinning/flaying while they are fully conscious

comments

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  • eBay qwSU57
    Animals are sentient beings. They exist on their own level of consciousness. Killing them, exploiting them for resources is not right. Just because a species can dominate another doesn't make them a free for all. It's been well documented that animals have intelligence, cognition, emotions. Why deprive them of their right to live unless they are threatening yours? There are nations full of vegetarians that are equally if not more healthy than primarily meat consuming nations.
    Jan 147
    • Apple fu manchu
      Uhh. Processed meats is like deli meat, hotdogs, and spam. Stuff that’s packed full of nitrates, salt & sugar, and chemical preservatives. Not “all meats”. Most people buy uncooked meat, prepare it to taste and cook it. That doesn’t make it processed. If this is you’re premise I think we’re done here.
      Jan 3
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Meats esp red meats have complex proteins (myoglobin) that *does* change in response to heat. Seriously read up on it. Cooking is certainly a type of "processing" that makes it happen. It's just hard to measure the impact from cooking since folks prefer their meat in several ways, but the processes that transform say myoglobin do not simply stop because it's being cooked at home instead of a factory.
      Again, read up on it before hurling insults, you might just save your own life in the process.
      (Fyi, folks back home won't even touch meat that still looks red, they want it cooked all the way)
      Jan 3
    • Amazon hy5ry
      Processed vegetables are also bad for you. Nobody eats a raw potato either and cooking it doesn't make it processed.

      You really got owned here. None of your links support anything you said and it turns out to be because you don't know what "processed" means!
      Jan 3
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Of course you are right about potatoes, but that's beside the point. Folks should eat french fries in spite of the risk not ignoring it!
      Same goes with red meats.
      Jan 3
    • Amazon hy5ry
      The point is there are health risks from PROCESSED FOODS, regardless of whether they are vegetables or meats.

      All your links related either to eating processed foods or eating an unbalanced diet. Not one of them suggested that a balanced diet shouldn't include meat. Not one.
      Jan 3
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Not one really? How about this...
      https://www.forksoverknives.com/animalproteindangers
      "...animal protein might be more appropriately described as “high risk” instead"
      Jan 3
    • Apple fu manchu
      NewYear you really are insufferable. That link above is a bunch of cherry picked nonsense to find anything bad. Meat has no fiber? No shit! Eat fiber. Free radicals? OMG, if only there was something called antioxidants that we could incorporate into our balanced diet to counteract free radicals. Might as well research the dangers of eating too much raspberries and suffering from imidacloprid toxicity, or drinking too much water until your electrolytes are flushed out. You know how many chemicals are on your cheap veggies?

      Get over it. You’re spewing nonsense. If you want to die on that hill, go right ahead. Stop being a hypochondriac and intentionally generalizing and lying.
      Jan 3
    • Amazon hy5ry
      Yeah after he realized that his own reputable sources contradicted him he has switched to fly by night blogs spouting pseudoscience.
      Jan 3
    • New / DataNewYear!
      I picked the first link that showed up on Google! There are hundreds of other links out there like it. BTW forks over knives is documentary worth watching. If you are critiquing something you haven't even seen or read you, are morons beyond repair living in your own reality.

      We are done here.
      Jan 3
    • Amazon hy5ry
      Yeah you're done, your only credible sources utterly refuted you and you didn't even realize it because you stupidly thought all meat was processed meat.
      Jan 3
  • Flagged by the community.

    • SAP Cabron
      I don't think 2019k said anything that deserved your words.
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Dont be an advocate for trolling.
      Jan 1
    • So that is how you will convince people? By going crazy?
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Who's crazy here?
      Jan 1
    • You, op, monomo
      Jan 1
    • OP, you need to calm down - 2019k is trolling. You did say nasty things and later edited your comments. Be respectful to humans and other beings, ✌️
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Ok I needed to calm down. But how about the incessant needful jokes coming here always, to every post and every other comment? Do you think it's funny anymore?
      Jan 1
    • I laugh at the good ones and ignore the rest! :)
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      When matters are serious, this sort of trolling aggravates things.
      Jan 1
    • No it does not. Shaant gadadhari bheem.
      Jan 1
  • Amazon yY7qW
    Animals exist to benefit humans
    Jan 119
    • Amazon, we didn't invent anything 😂 - everything exists, and has existed even before the time of human beings.
      We're mere mortals, like any other (granted with higher intelligence/evolved beings) that discover things and give things form and call it "invention"
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      We invented morality, ethics, religion, these are creations of human culture.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon dibidibidu
      @amazon. It is a very naive and simplistically anthropcentric worldview to assert that humans are the only animals to have values and that further, we somehow "created" values. All living things, exercise goal driven behaviors to achieve or attain things they value. The only difference between humans and every other living thing in this regard, is that humans have conceptualized this and decided to call this concept, "valuation". Just think about it for 5 minutes, seriously.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      Every view of the world is anthropcentric. There are actually no non human views of the world. No animals ever discovered other than us think at a level sufficient to have formed an opinion about the world.

      Value IS a concept and as you say we are the only ones who conceptualize. We made up all the concepts related to morality because it was useful to us to do so.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Ok, @yY7qW I agree, you have neither morality nor values, so may I at least slaughter you now?! I already promised to be gentle.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon dibidibidu
      @amazon. You are confusing sentience and conciousness; as well as values verses morality. Values,preceed moral inference. An exstisential understanding of the world is not required for an animal to possess values. You are moving the goal posts of your own argument with these conflations.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      Animals don't have values in the sense we are using them here, as tenets to guide behavior in the face of complex moral choices. Only human have that, and really only adult humans. Human children don't even develop that kind of ability until they are at least a couple years old, sometime after the develop language ability.

      Animals have instincts and scripted behaviors and a limited ability to learn from experience which results in some concept of good versus bad (as in the yellow ones tastes better than the green ones so I like the yellow ones better), but they have no concept of good versus evil.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      so.. Wait! What! You're saying...eat.. Children??!!??!!!
      Ok folks remember I called dibs on slaughtering this guy first!
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      You fail at logic and common sense.

      Your reasoning, "A are D, A are not C, and B are also not C, therefore B are also D" where A are animals, B are children, C are things that have values and D are things you eat.

      You are unbelievably bad at basic logic, no wonder you believe such dumb stuff.

      We're done here!
      Jan 2
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Good, keep working on your A,B,C's it's an important first step 😂
      Jan 2
  • New / DataNewYear!
    Human guts evolved at a time when our rhesus monkey ancestors were chewing leaves. Unlike guts of carnivorous animals which are smooth, human guts have hair like things called villi, which really bad at processing meat and really good at processing plants. This naturally results in a host of ill outcomes when meat makes its way there.
    For the tldr, here is a neutral link that does not even talk about the humanitarian aspect..
    https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/protein/
    Go vegan, spare the planet for future generations.
    Happy new year folks!
    Jan 122
    • eBay qwSU57
      Canines are for tearing (pronounced in meat eaters), incisors for cutting (mainly herbivores), your point being? Don't conveniently point to the canines and ignore the other evidence. Also, blatantly accusing a counterpoint to be based off of vegan 'religious' views or whatever is fanatical in itself.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Good demonstration of selective reading. Completely missed statements like this one eh?
      "Get your protein from plants when possible. "
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      There is a huge, huge difference between "don't eat meat" and "eat more vegetables". Most people DON'T eat ENOUGH vegetables but it also the case that some people (vegans) don't eat enough meat. You need a balance. The article makes NO claim that people should stop eating meat and in fact includes recommended meats.

      Talk about selective reading!

      And yes you have teeth in your mouth that evolved to tear meat, you have a stomach with the right enzymes to digest meat, and your ancestors all lived in settlements where we find from the bones that they carved up that they ate meat.

      You can CHOOSE not to eat the things you body evolved to be able to eat but don't bullshit.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Of course, it does not say don't eat meat directly. But it certainly talks about several aspects of getting protein from meat - emissions with harm to environment, list of diseases and harm to human body in unequivocal terms. It also does clearly state the central theme, "get protein from plants when possible". Indeed, if you are a frozen cave man with no possible choice but meat, much of that won't apply 😊
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      Again, we can talk about managing our environment by correctly pricing petroleum products and agricultural products so that their emission costs are included in the price, and we should do that.

      But that has nothing to do with the the whole unsupported lunatic claim that eating meat appropriately is harmful or wrong. It's not.

      What is true and what that article is getting at is that people eat too much of the wrong kind of meat and not enough vegetables.

      You trying to rewrite it into "meat is bad" is just dishonest.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      What's wrong is you denying simple facts. Look, eating meat is a choice. It can be made In Spite of the risks and harm. But it should certainly not be made in denial of basic facts - Meat consumption is bad for human health and environment.
      Jan 1
    • Cisco / Eng0.1
      @yY7qW, did you watch that video yet?

      If not, here you go again.
      https://youtu.be/vtqfsPg8BFQ

      Since you sound pretty smart it should be easy for you to understand the case against animal slaughter.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      I don't have any problem with animal slaughter. Animals don't have rights. The only social reason why we make it illegal to abuse animals is that the people who do that often go on to abuse humans, but that is not as concern in the context of a food processing facility.

      And @newyear cut the bullshit that meat consumption is bad for human health, you just lie about what your sources actually said.

      You find some article that suggests a balanced diet and because it says eat less meat you LIE and claim it supports eating no meat.

      I don't like liars.
      Jan 2
    • Cisco / Eng0.1
      Ok. I hear you.

      The steak we eat (well I used to eat) comes from cows that are fed with ground fish and grains from poor/developing nations.

      They sell the grains to the west while their own people can’t afford to buy the local grains.

      Yep, that video is only about 10min long.

      Good luck!
      Jan 2
    • Amazon yY7qW
      It's much better for developing nations to engage in trade and have products to sell. Cutting off their businesses from the international market will actually kill people.

      The video is pretty mindless.
      Jan 2
  • Amazon yY7qW
    Cows are a domesticated species, they exist to be part of the human food chain. Stop using them as food and they go extinct, or maybe a handful survive in a zoo. They have no natural environment to live in: Ranches ARE their natural environment.

    We can discuss whether it makes sense to price animal products properly so that the impact on the environment is managed, and we should manage our resources properly.

    But that's what they are: resources, like petroleum.
    Jan 15
    • New monomo
      OP
      How will they go extinct if we stop using them as food?
      Sure they're a domesticated species, but they're not supposed to be domesticated like this, with this sort of torture.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      Cows are domesticated aurochs. The last wild auroch went extinct a few centuries ago. Unlike the now extinct aurochs, cattle have no ability to survive in the wild and entirely rely on people for their existence.

      Their natural habitat is the ranch and if we stop growing them for food the only place they might survive is a zoo. It's unlikely zoos would keep a large enough herd for genetic diversity so in the long run if all humans become vegan then all these domesticated species like cows, chickens etc.,go extinct.

      At the very least there with be a massive die off.
      Jan 1
    • New / DataNewYear!
      Of all the creatures cows are least likely to die if left alone in a pasture. They just need grass! Amazon must have a meat processing division - no wonder that you are trying to save your job so desperately?
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      What pasture? Land is gonna get used.
      Jan 1
    • VMware BobbleHat
      NewYear you’ve obviously never seen a pack of wolves tearing a live cow apart. Maybe you should
      Jan 2
  • Turned vegan a few years ago - life’s hard without ice creams and other desserts :) Totally worth it though! Need to be mentally strong - good luck in your journey!
    Jan 17
    • Facebook
      slothmachn

      Facebook

      BIO
      .
      slothmachnmore
      I prefer the non-dairy ice creams and sorbets, and I'm not even vegan
      Jan 1
    • Microsoft / EngTier 1
      If it’s non dairy it’s not ice cream.
      Jan 1
    • The New York Times moony
      Van Llewelyn makes incredible vegan ice cream.
      Jan 1
    • Tier 1 - +1 😂😂

      NYT - Haven't heard of them, will look them up for sure, thanks for sharing!
      Jan 1
    • Unity mooooo
      Some coconut milk based “ice creams” Luna & Larry’s Coconut Bliss and So Delicious beat the other store bought dairy alternatives.
      Jan 1
    • Looks like I've been living under a rock, I'm heading to the store today to look for these ice creams 😆
      Jan 1
    • Very good I will love you guys turning vegan, damn the price of beef has been going through the roof. If you all turn vegan than perhaps the price will come down. Nothing better than that - more beef for me!
      Jan 1
  • Apple fu manchu
    For the uninitiated, you need to always research everything you eat and everything you buy. This is the US. Good products exist. It’s up to you to find it and vote with your wallet. The FDA and USDA isn’t really out to watch your back.

    And since you just now realized the truth about dairy. Understand the truth about the livestock industry. And when you’re done with that, understand the petrochemical dependency with produce and how you’re eating chemicals that cause insects stomachs to explode, but is “harmless” to humans. Then there’s the chemical industry in general and how everyone is exposed to toxic chemical daily and how these chemical cocktails are causing your daughters to hit puberty at the age of 10. Finally, understand the fragrance industry and how companies are free and unregulated to put any chemical they want and call it a “fragrance” because calling something a “fragrance” means it’s proprietary and outside the scope of regulators.

    You’ll find the dairy industry is just chump change.

    And before some wants to think I’m some crazy liberal vegan nut job, I’m definitely a carnivore. Just very careful and mindful of reality.
    Jan 14
    • New monomo
      OP
      I am sorry but I still feel the dairy industry is the most horrid of all.
      Jan 1
    • Apple fu manchu
      It’s cruel. But it’s not the worst for me. Get to know the farmers at your local farmers market. They’ll sell you the good stuff.

      I grew up on a farm where we milked our own cows and slaughtered our own livestock humanely.
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      So you suggest buying products from the local farms?
      Jan 1
    • Apple fu manchu
      It’s a good place to start. Ask questions obviously.
      Jan 1
  • Microsoft / EngTier 1
    This is purely a US issue.

    Try organic grass fed dairy and beef products.
    Jan 12
    • New monomo
      OP
      Even grass-fed and organic are just marketing terms to fool consumers, they hardly make any difference.
      Jan 1
    • Booking.com bquiet
      In the US.
      Jan 1
  • HPE Pnmi52
    Great, more tasty beef and cheese for me! I have worked in dairy farms and raised calves for beef. The animals are not unhappy, just bored. Any hardships they do have are far less than those experienced by wild animals.
    Jan 10
  • Cisco / Eng0.1
    I stopped eating all meat after hearing Phillip Wollen’s speech.

    I was certain someday I would need to give up dairy and eggs. Are there any sources of dairy that is cruelty-free?
    Jan 19
    • New monomo
      OP
      It is not. Its 10 times worse than the meat industry which is already cruel enough.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      So what?
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      So nothing. You don't care, so you don't need to take part in this discussion. Understand that animals have a life too.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      So do plants. So what?
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Imagine taking the place of one of those bulls, or the cow. Even then if you don't feel a thing, you're welcome to get out of this thread
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      Except I won't ever take their place because I'm not a cow and neither are you. Grow up.
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      I grew long ago. You grew up without emotions and mercy maybe. Get the fuck out of here.
      Jan 1
    • Amazon yY7qW
      I grew up without emotion because I don't share your crazy beliefs?

      😂😂😂

      Some religious psychosis there.
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Eat some cow shit. Maybe that's the right food for you.
      Jan 1
  • Pandora / Engwombat🙈
    What documentary did you watch? I am also trying to be vegan.
    Jan 15
  • Amazon Almonds09
    Livestock farming, including meat and Diary is also number 1 cause of Global Warming and pollution.
    Even I am considering going Vegan this year
    Jan 11
    • Yup! - go for it! Totally worth it, change yourself and others will follow :)
      Jan 1
  • Airbnb
    jim.hodlen

    Airbnb

    BIO
    kindly doing the needful
    jim.hodlenmore
    would it be better for grass-fed cows?
    Jan 13
    • New monomo
      OP
      No better, that's what I read. It's all marketing gimmicks
      Jan 1
    • Airbnb
      jim.hodlen

      Airbnb

      BIO
      kindly doing the needful
      jim.hodlenmore
      my late grandpa refused to eat bovine products later in his life. he used to raise cattle at some point and developed affections for them.
      Jan 1
    • New monomo
      OP
      Hats off to him. Very rare to find people like him at all.
      Jan 1
  • VMware BobbleHat
    Folks in this bubble need to get out and see what nature really is. There is no such thing as being nice. The thing you learned about a a food chain is just one thing after another, eating each other(usually alive and painful death).

    Once you get to the top predator you die and microbes move your nutritional value back to the bottom of the chain.

    This is nature. This is natural. Human eating animal is nature. Human eating animal is natural.

    For religious folks - this is the system God built.

    For philosophical folks - pain and death are part of the circle of life. Pretending that you can absolve yourself from being guilty, is denying your own nature and your own existence.

    You must kill in order to stay alive. You killed many sentient creatures today just living. By the time you die, even as a vegan, you will have killed billions of intelligent creatures, as small as ants and other insects, to mammals such as regular killing of rabbits and gophers that threaten your vegetable farm.

    Even a cute outdoor house cat adds an average of 200 birds per year being painfully chewed and eaten alive.
    Jan 20
  • Amazon Fetch
    Not all dairy farms are like this. Get to know your local farmers, smaller operations typically care for their animals long term. Their products do cost more, but are worth it in my opinion. Anyone who has worked with animals knows they have their own personalities, emotions, etc.

    I grew up on farms, we had several cows and their calves till they passed away at old ages (15-17 years typically). We loved them and they loved us.

    It’s become a complicated issue as the price per gallon of milk makes it next to impossible for small/family dairy farms to exist. The price is being artificially lowered by large conglomerate operations and large stores using milk as a loss leader.

    We were always lucky that we had a larger farm with cows, sheep, chickens, pigs, and grew cash crops.
    Jan 10
  • Sirius XM HfIbQ65
    The cheeseburger I just had was delicious.
    Jan 10
  • New DuQvV7x
    The same generally applies to all industrially farmed animals.
    Jan 10
  • VMware BobbleHat
    It would be awesome to see using anesthesia while slaughtering cattle. Anyone who eats the resulting steak also gets to experience unconsciousness.
    Jan 22
    • Amazon yY7qW
      To expensive for no benefit, the only valid consideration is whether the method impacts the flavor.
      Jan 2
    • VMware BobbleHat
      Hopefully the sarcasm was evident there, the op expressed disdain that cattle weren’t given anesthesia. A quick painless death/unconsciousness is the clear winner such as the common captive bolt pistol.
      Jan 2
  • Amazon / OpsVisual
    How did you find out?
    Jan 12
    • New monomo
      OP
      At a local restaurant, some stranger told me about this and I looked it up
      Jan 1
    • Are you Indian Hindu?
      Jan 1
  • Americans aren’t much bothered by animal cruelty. Somehow I have started to shut myself out to these things too. All this used to trouble me in the past but now it troubles me how it doesn’t anymore.
    Jan 11
    • Amazon yY7qW
      You are cured
      Jan 1
  • This comment was deleted by original commenter.

    • Microsoft / EngTier 1
      The US? And you’re a member of PETA?
      Jan 2
  • Unity mooooo
    I prefer buying imported ghee, Kerrygold grass fed butter, and cheeses from Europe.
    Jan 10

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