Diversity talk is just white dudes maintaining power

Apple / Eng lmfaoapple
Jun 25 40 Comments

So at Apple, I’ve noticed all management is some version of a tall white guy from a privileged background. Diversity/SJW talk in general lately has been on a huge upswing at the company - but it’s always down by some Walmart version of Craig/eddy/Tim. Cliques/in groups form around white culture - to get anything done in my current department you have to nod your head and hope to be included in these groups.

Anyways I just had a thought that SJW speech has just become a signal that you’re part of the “woke whites” and good to ascend to power at Silicon Valley companies. This type of speech is not normal for mixed race/minorities to engage in.

I don’t hate white people at all, but it’s a phenomenon I’ve noticed at least at Apple.

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TOP 40 Comments
  • Indeed getlikeme
    I can appreciate this post and to some extent I agree. As a woman of color, I have become very frustrated with the bullshit talking points and politics from the D&I community. It’s divisive. It demonizes people. It attempts to tell people how to think about race, culture, sexual orientation and the hardship surrounding it. It supports the token (insert minority group) mentality just to check the “I got me one” box. It doesn’t hold people of color accountable but rather furthers a sort of victim mentality and one of entitlement which only serves to divide us more. It shuts down white voices and those not aligned with its agenda, and gives the appearances that underrepresented groups have a voice and place. It has become this charade for companies to claim they are diverse and inclusive but a closer look will quickly reveal MANY cracks. It really does feel like a white crusade, led by a certain type of white person who seeks to prop up people of color/LGBT (puppets) for box-checking purposes. A lot of those efforts and sentiments stop at the office door where folks go home to communities and social circles that are all white or minority.

    Speaking of Apple, didn’t they fire one of their head D&I leaders because she said you can have diversity in a room of all white men with blue eyes, or something to that effect? I remember being enraged when I heard about the backlash to this. But you read through the comments to see people were just pissed because she veered off the approved talking points : “white men are evil, power hungry and need to be shunned in a corner.” 🙄 We all missed the greater point being made.

    D&I in how it’s promoted today is a crock of shit that caricaturizes the issues, pits and otherizes people against one another, and sorely lacks when it comes to cultivating understanding and driving genuine inclusivity. It is fueling a lot of hostility between people inside and outside of the workplace.

    And having worked at several companies, I can tell you these problems are not just part of the tech industry.
    Jun 25 12
    • SAP Man
      ^ I was referring to organizations looking to "fix" "diversity", leading to the poor approach to D&I we see today, being flawed. There's no true goal other than to keep "getting better", there's no way to quantify diversity in a beneficial way for any group. It's a KPI with no target and no ceiling. That's why it's unquantifiable.

      You're also accusing me of insinuating a lot of things, while insisting I'm doing the same towards you, which I'm not. I was simply asking your opinion on the last point to point of how it's a sticky situation and there's no right answer. I didn't say I support only hiring the best person 100% of the time, I just asked if you support that. Quotas are fundamentally wrong and you can't quantify a "right" target number.

      Let's keep it friendly, I think we agree on more than you realize. Saying people "have a poor understand" is very ignorant of you, especially given our extremely limited interaction. My point is still relevant: diversity as a KPI is unquantifiable and P&I efforts using it as a KPI is fundamentally flawed. Should we get rid of D&I efforts entirely? No.
      Jun 25
    • Indeed getlikeme
      Nothing unfriendly about what I had to say. I stand by my observations until there’s evidence to the contrary.

      “Best person” is incredibly subjective.

      The idea that you can’t quantify people and the ways in which they identify themselves to establish whether your organization has a mixed representation is simply laughable.

      You can establish KPIs around anything, the hard part is gaining consensus and driving results against them.

      And yes, we need to revamp our current approach to D&I because it is dated, tainted and exclusive.
      Jun 25
    • Microsoft unfanged
      Nothing unfriendly? What planet do you live on? You called them insulting, baseless, hostile, not able to grasp D&I, and that they seek to discredit. Pretty harsh words while they’ve been nothing but respectful.
      Jun 25
    • SAP Man
      I can see you're committed to entirely misreading or misunderstanding simple sentences, misattributing stances, and you're just looking to sling baseless to further your non-existent point. This is a common tactic among individuals who feel their owed something, but it doesn't win meaningful discussion.

      Feel free to continue alone :)
      Jun 25
    • Indeed getlikeme
      ^ I understand you quite clearly. Your feelings are clearly hurt because I don’t agree with or affirm you.

      “This is a common tactic among individuals who feel owed.”

      😂 And “owed” what exactly? Please continue proving my point. I pinpointed your prejudice rhetoric the moment I saw it, especially when you edited “unqualified people of *color* being propped up as figureheads” to read “unqualified people” as if it was any less insulting. Not to mention you replied with similar sentiments throughout the main thread. But my pointing out your missteps make me “unfriendly” and (the irony) “ignorant.”

      Oh my 🤭

      No @unfanged, I’m not here to placate, appease, nor befriend you.

      I will speak truth and shine light on behavior exactly as it stands and I won’t beg your forgiveness nor apologize in the process. If it sounds harsh, too bad.

      And I’m glad you claim to be done with this conversation. Bye

      😌
      Jun 25
  • Microsoft / Other
    unicornCod

    Microsoft Other

    PRE
    Apple, Microsoft
    unicornCodmore
    Um Tim Cook is gay. You have one of those smallest minorities as your CEO.
    Jun 25 2
    • Apple / Eng lmfaoapple
      OP
      Yes a gay white male, which is a blessed SJW class - lots of back pats all around. Why are Asian men extremely underrepresented in leadership roles at the company while being over represented at the company?
      Jun 25
    • Microsoft / Other
      unicornCod

      Microsoft Other

      PRE
      Apple, Microsoft
      unicornCodmore
      Also from a poor background. Cooks parents were like a dock worker and a bank teller.
      Jun 25
  • Amazon chunk
    It's okay to be white
    Jun 25 2
    • Charter / IT xlyq06
      Preach it chunk. It's ok to be anything. Why are people/objects/dinosaurs or whatever you want to ca yourself always so upset when they dont see themselves successful
      Jun 25
    • SAP Man
      It's okay to be white
      Jun 25
  • This comment was deleted by original commenter.

    • Autodesk sodjdjekrm
      He works for the board
      Jun 25
    • Apple / Eng lmfaoapple
      OP
      He’s white? I’m not talking about neo nazis
      Jun 25
    • SAP Man
      There's less gay people than black people. Having a black guy, instead of a gay guy, wouldn't be diverse enough. OP is a bigot.
      Jun 25
  • Amazon / Eng eztP64
    As a white guy, I do try to put in an honest effort to be socially aware, but I think it is important for us (meaning white men) to be aware of what we're saying and whether our actions support it or whether we're just posturing to feel good about ourselves. The latter does nothing but shift from one exclusionary culture to another, as you point out.
    Jun 25 7
    • SAP Man
      ^ it doesn't matter what he is. Stop propping people up. Your opinion is no more valuable than anyone else's if you place any amount of value on ethic background.
      Jun 25
    • Amazon / Eng eztP64
      I don't really care what he is either, but he is the one that brought it up, so I asked for clarification. I don't think my opinion intrinsically has greater value because of my skin color or background at all.
      Jun 25
    • SAP Man
      You do care, that's why you qualified your initial post by saying you're a white guy.
      Jun 25
    • Amazon / Eng eztP64
      It was directly relevant to the topic, which was white guys and diversity talks.
      Jun 25
    • Snapchat gqkO66
      I’m a white guy from Asian. Go look at a map and figure how that’s possible. Hint: it has to do with the word “Caucasian”
      Jun 25
  • SAP Man
    You're right, diversity talks should just be award shows where underqualified people of color get pushed into upper management of billion dollar companies.
    Jun 25 0
  • Autodesk sodjdjekrm
    Diversity is a myth
    Jun 25 2
    • Illumina
      dbsktn

      Illumina

      PRE
      Illumina
      dbsktnmore
      Yeah you still have to produce results at Apple
      Jun 25
    • Autodesk sodjdjekrm
      Like what?
      Jun 25
  • Google / Eng decisive
    Interesting. Yeah maybe SJW is the right political move right now.

    We're all getting mad at SJWs and try to preach the truth to our own personal detriment career wise.
    Jun 25 1
    • Autodesk sodjdjekrm
      SJW is the right political move, i am hopeful that millennials are empathetic and can see through the myths.
      Jun 25
  • Snapchat gqkO66
    Personal theory: woke whiteness is not about helping blacks but pushing down Asians. One is a real threat to white elites the other historically not
    Jun 25 1
    • Apple / Eng lmfaoapple
      OP
      I don’t know if it’s a conscious agenda, but if we’re talking about politics of power it certainly had that effect. E.g. Harvard’s personality score
      Jun 25
  • Jet.com / Other
    gtfoorgtfo

    Jet.com Other

    PRE
    Starbucks
    gtfoorgtfomore
    It’s just the way white americans understand diversity.
    Jun 25 0
  • Amazon
    Amz

    Amazon

    BIO
    Yo-yo Chen
    Amzmore
    Interesting point of view.
    Jun 25 0

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