Evaluate Google T4 offer (Sea/Kirkland)

Amazon zVIe28
Mar 10, 2018 72 Comments

Base 145k
Stocks 300k / 4 yrs
Target Bonus 15%
Sign-on 50k

Years of experience 8
Sde2 @amzn aws, current TC 230k

How is the offer, meh?

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TOP 72 Comments
  • Microsoft / Eng
    AmlEvil

    Microsoft Eng

    BIO
    Sinful birth under the cross
    AmlEvilmore
    So what’s the TC per year?

    ~240, which is very close to what you’re making at Amazon?

    Sure, +50K first year...

    Sounds like you need a competing offer, this is typical Google.
    Mar 10, 2018 16
    • Uber zxngr
      Yeah I was like you. Regret joining and wasting time there. Google is not what it was 10 years ago.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      OP, fuck them. They need to learn that their brand’s value is not all that great compared to the other interesting companies, and they have to at least match others’ offers.

      I think somebody in Google’s HR is currently getting rewarded for this “strategy”, but they better watch out 😂
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      I’ve seen some funny cost-cutting things, such as offering 2 weeks of vacation to new hires instead of 3, at Microsoft in the mid-2000s. The people responsible for those had been sacked.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Uber zxngr
      Isn't Amazon still doing that?
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      Amazon? Doing what?
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Uber zxngr
      New hires getting 1 week shorter vacations during the first year.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Amazon SomeName2
      I don’t think so. Amazon only gives you 2 weeks now and then 6 personal days. Don’t see them taking away a week.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Uber Eats64
      OP what’s the obsession with Google? I worked there until two years ago and the place sucks now. Your Uber offer is pretty solid imo for L4.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Uber zxngr
      SomeName, I remember it was 2w only first year, then 3w from year 2 and 4w from year 5 or 6.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Amazon SomeName2
      The comment above was about a new hire so I was only referencing starting vacation. I believe that 3 weeks starts after 2 years so in your year 3.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Google Facebook
    Awesome offer above median. We have an internal compensation spreadsheet to prove that, since on Blind you can sometimes see ridiculous numbers.
    Mar 10, 2018 8
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      It doesn’t make sense to switch companies for this little of a difference in pay. That is, unless the person is running away from something, or has no other options.

      In this case, at least one is clearly not the case.

      I just think Google is too arrogant and behind the times.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Google Facebook
      I really doubt anything can be worse than working for Amazon. Google is a paradise comparing to it.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      This is very dependent on the team. People also talk trash about working for Microsoft, but my team and my manager are very good. Going to another company and trying your luck there is a risk.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Amazon zVIe28
      OP
      @AmlEvil I hear you. I am in good place(top tt rating) currently. However Google had been sort of dream company and was hoping it to me bit more competitive.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Mesosphere onsie
      Hmm, I would suggest sticking to the team if the work is good unless Google bumps by atleast 15 percent. There are basically playing you since they know you are inclined on them.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Google Facebook
      Microsoft is times better than Amazon, imo.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEval

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvalmore
      Can’t say anything about dreams other than, what do you think about Steve Yegge’s criticism?

      My favorite part about interviewing at Google was meeting former Microsofties there. I didn’t feel like anyone was too excited about what they were working on, frankly. I even went to some event where a panel of employees was supposed to tell us why working at Google was cool, but I got the opposite impression.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • O'Reilly Media NidV30
      Google has an internal comp sheet? Is it broken down by level and department (eng, pm, design, etc) as well?

      That’s pretty cool. Can’t wait to see it and feel bad about my TC.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • LinkedIn Fcjgchd
    Forget Google with those numbers. I was in the same situation like you 2 year ago, from AWS and got offers from both Google and LinkedIn. Google recruiters thought that I would be crazy about their brand name and tried to lowballl me with an initial offer that’s even lower than my Amzn comp at that time.

    LinkedIn then offered me 20% up and I joined them without bothering negotiating more with Google. I am now extremely happy with my work at LinkedIn and my comp also went up another 20%, excluding msft stock appreciation, due to raise, bonus, and stock refresher.

    See what are you gonna work on and who are you gonna work, rather than just a company name.
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Mesosphere onsie
    Hmm, isn’t that just 240k total comp; only 10k more than what you make. Why do you even care to move?
    Mar 10, 2018 2
    • Amazon SomeName2
      It’s 240k without sign on so that’s worthwhile. Plus having Google on your resume is a win. OP can be there 2 years and come back to Amazon for new sign on and bump.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Amazon Pivoteee
      Sureee come back to amazon with free bananas and PIPs
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Microsoft / Eng
    AmlEvil

    Microsoft Eng

    BIO
    Sinful birth under the cross
    AmlEvilmore
    Google seems to think their brand is important to people.

    In order to want to switch, you mentally put your current position and the new position on your hedonic scale. The increase in value must be perceptible.

    The value of the status quo (something you already have, including the comfort of knowing your environment and the people) is non-zero.

    So, Google thinks that:

    Current 💰 + status quo <<< new 💰 + the Google brand

    Since old and new 💰 are about equal, they must think that

    Your status quo << the Google brand

    True?

    At least, for me, it isn’t true, so the money aspect has to make the inequality there work.
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Amazon SomeName2
    Everything except the base looks good. Also, the base is really important if you’re buying a house or similar. Congrats on your offer!
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
    Don’t forget to include 50k stock award annually in your total comp. looks like you forgot that.
    Mar 10, 2018 8
    • Amazon zVIe28
      OP
      What award(google or Amazon?) ? I believe refresher is at Manager's discretion but not a guaranteed thing.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
      At Google. I don’t know about Amazon. You should hav target stock bonus around30-50k at your level.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Amazon zVIe28
      OP
      I see, recruiter never mentioned anything about that
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
      Even Microsoft has stock award :-)
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      Why “even”?
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
      Even you have to ask that.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      Microsoft has changed our compersation scheme very little over the last 15 years. Stock refreshers are something you can expect, and they give you the range for your level explicitly.

      It’s not the same at other companies, but it’s good to know what to ask about.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • LinkedIn Fcjgchd
      Stock refresher is performance based, and I don’t think Google L4 can get that much.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Google / Eng 6zhf0xgi
    You're at AWS moving to Google Seattle - which is basically cloud. You should be able to get more. Definitely in stock.
    Mar 10, 2018 1
    • Amazon zVIe28
      OP
      Yup, matched team is in cloud space.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Google razz
    I think you should get more contrary to what people say here. $250K/y is close to the target for that level.

    You can get > than that. In fact you can get L5 comp or more (“out of band”) if you negotiate
    Mar 10, 2018 3
    • Amazon zVIe28
      OP
      By target you mean median? Or Max?
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      Median, of course.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Google razz
      Yeah, median
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Microsoft / Other Helloh
    Base is low
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Microsoft / Eng 92305
    Curious - what’s the target comp for an L7 in google’s Seattle office?
    Mar 10, 2018 3
    • Google / Eng 6zhf0xgi
      L7? Like a jillion dollars.
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng 92305
      I am serious though, interested in the rsu refresh target and comp ranges
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft GetiT45
      Like a freakin grillion dollars
      Mar 12, 2018
  • Uber Ucoin
    Is it normal for people with 8 ye to get a t4? Can't you try t5?
    Mar 10, 2018 1
    • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
      Very normal. Op is sde2 at Amazon.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Google bupkis2
    It's a solid comp for your market... Don't fall into the trap of comparing to Bay area comps.

    Google has better work life balance and your pay will increase dramatically faster year over year as gsu refreshes attack on top of one another.

    I started in a non Bay area market 3 years ago with an l4 offer substantially less than yours. My comp this year as l5 will be North of 380.

    Granted, it may go down a bit next year but I'm not particularly worried about that.
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Amazon zVIe28
    OP
    Yes, Sde 3 is almost 2 quarters to an year away(Not guaranteed as well)
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • eBay gxAJ68
    230 is per year or over 4 years, if its per year, then your offer is very low
    Mar 10, 2018 0
  • Google / Eng
    sergey

    Google Eng

    BIO
    Haha
    sergeymore
    This is more than what I got three years ago in MTV and I'm making 400k now after the annual refreshes and stock appreciation.
    Mar 12, 2018 4
    • Google / Eng hy9ht0vc6
      How did you get such giant refresh? Promotion?
      Mar 12, 2018
    • Google / Eng
      sergey

      Google Eng

      BIO
      Haha
      sergeymore
      I got promoted last cycle but all my refreshes were for an L4. The last one was $150k.
      Mar 12, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng 92305
      What are the target refreshers for other levels?
      Mar 12, 2018
    • Mesosphere onsie
      What’s your point though? Are you trying to suggest OP should accept this low ball offer in the kind hopes that the market would make the GOOGL stock make a killing? Doesn’t make much sense to me.
      Mar 13, 2018
  • Google naiseyab
    Recently promoted T4 making 325k+ TC

    Do negotiate
    Mar 11, 2018 3
    • Google Facebook
      Wonder what you’ve been making as T3?
      Mar 11, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng 92305
      Wow that’s L65 level comp
      Mar 11, 2018
    • Google naiseyab
      Approx.320k

      I am sure there are T4 s making 400k
      Mar 11, 2018
  • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
    Nope. Offer is 250k per year. Above average. Pretty good! Plus you should have stock award every year too.
    Mar 10, 2018 2
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      And wouldn’t the other companies give stock awards every year, too?

      I think Amazon does not, but the others do, no?
      Mar 10, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bluetesla
      How much stock award does op get? Thisis a very competitive offer. I believe Google stock award is around 50k extra per year,so I’d say total comp is around 300k
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Facebook movebot
    Not sure if Google pays same in Seattle area as bay area but in Bay area t4 goes to soft cap of 165k base and they will even go over a bit to compete when you're underleveled. Get some competing offers! FB pays the same in Seattle and bay area btw 😉

    RSUs and signing look good but could even go up with competing (assuming they pay equivalently in Seattle as bay area)
    Mar 10, 2018 1
    • Microsoft / Eng
      AmlEvil

      Microsoft Eng

      BIO
      Sinful birth under the cross
      AmlEvilmore
      He does have competing offers. Also, my impression was that Google also pays the same in both locales, unlike Microsoft.
      Mar 10, 2018
  • Facebook / Eng
    MsCurious

    Facebook Eng

    PRE
    Cisco
    MsCuriousmore
    Google and Facebook are better environment for an engineer in first 10 years. Optimize for that rather for the differences of around $10k-$20k a year. Unless you take chances with a startup, my advice here is to gain solid experience first for your future earnings.
    Mar 10, 2018 0

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