Compensation

FB E4 offer evaluation

Apple / Eng
MacFAN

AppleEng

PRE
Intel Corporation
MacFANmore
Jan 10

I'm currently ICT4 @ Apple with 9 years of exp (4 years in A). Got an offer for SWE E4 with 165k base and 290k stocks, 40k sign. I'm making more in Apple now and I told the recruiter my total comp beforehand.

Why did I get leveled down? Interviews were good.
Any chance to negotiate higher comp or level up?
I'm puzzled.

comments

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  • Facebook / EnggJJA84
    Yeah E4 with your resume is a flat-out low-ball. I'm kind of shocked tbh.

    I'm not on a hiring committee but have plenty of interview experience at FB. Biggest determinant of level on offer is how you do on the design/architecture interview but who knows.

    Honestly I would walk away unless they give you E5+. I know several good engineers that were misleveled at hire. They got immediately promoted the next performance cycle, but they missed out on the RSUs they would have had if their initial offers were leveled properly, and that's serious money.
    Jan 1010
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      Is it possible to get a level upgrade after the E4 offer was already presented? Or the offer level is already set in stone?
      Jan 10
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      And yes I'm also surprised as I have told the recruiter my current salary, got a lower offer anyway...
      Jan 10
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      Not completely sure if they'll negotiate on level, but worth a shot. If I were in your shoes I would probably not budge on it and be willing to walk, but I'm not you.
      Jan 10
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      Yep, this is what is most probably going to happen
      Jan 11
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      Otherwise possiblity I guess is that you could negotiate to the rsu/bonus ceiling which could get you close to the E5 floor 🤷
      Jan 11
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      It's not all bad. Stick around a couple years and then lateral. Next offer you take you'll be in a much better position to negotiate.
      Jan 11
    • Citrix Systems genius123
      Yes it’s not all bad. Free food , shuttles. Ability to express ideas in a team. But once you find out fresh graduates E3 are getting 75K signon bonus. How will you justify I got 0$ on E4.
      Jan 11
    • LinkedIn Vogy87
      @Citrix Signon is totally determined according to your leverage. If you are hesitant to join because of a competing offer or your current TC is higher, companies use their signon trick.
      Jan 11
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      > But once you find out fresh graduates E3 are getting 75K signon bonus. How will you justify I got 0$ on E4.

      Welcome to capitalism my dude. FB's only purpose to to maximize shareholder value. They will pay you the minimum amount they can get away with.
      Jan 11
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      If you really hate it, interview somewhere else and get a better offer.
      Jan 11
  • Microsoft FFSake
    They count in that you are used to no free food, so level you accordingly to keep you in shape
    Jan 101
  • Facebook hghftd
    I know a lot of p new grads making to E4 in 6 months. Do not take it.
    Jan 111
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      Yup, I am one of them
      Jan 11
  • Facebook
    alterego

    Facebook

    PRE
    Microsoft
    BIO
    dev, human,
    alteregomore
    Out of the experience , how many years are in software? For e4 you need less than 4-5 years, otherwise you get automatically put for e5 or no hire
    Jan 116
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      All in software - I was in Qualcomm in HW team for a few years but still doing software coding. Even if I cut that then I have 6 full SW yoe.
      Jan 11
    • Facebook
      alterego

      Facebook

      PRE
      Microsoft
      BIO
      dev, human,
      alteregomore
      6 years is upper boundary of e4, 9-10 years of experience either gets you to e5 or no offer because lack of skill development assumed if you don't perform as a Senior person
      Jan 11
    • Facebook
      alterego

      Facebook

      PRE
      Microsoft
      BIO
      dev, human,
      alteregomore
      E4 probably you had a not so good design or behavioral interview
      Jan 11
    • Facebook / EnggJJA84
      Yup, most likely design did not go as well as OP thought
      Jan 11
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      Ok, IMO it went ok, recruiter did not say anything about issues with architecture or behavioral (the only problematic interview was networking, which they said is least important). Thanks for the input, it is possible I judge myself better than the interviewers.
      7d
    • Apple iwvwh
      Is this for Production Engineering (Since you said networking) I know of a friend who got brutally downleveled because they didn’t have any SRE/PE experience.
      7d
  • New gatedux
    Check out http://levels.fyi offers for comparison
    Jan 111
    • Apple / EngMacFAN
      OP
      Looks like ICT4 maps way better to E5 than E4 :/
      Jan 11
  • New xbkou
    What's your TC at Apple?
    2d0
  • Apple susbeu
    Same situation. What’s the update?
    2d0

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