Google verbal offer sucks

May 30 79 Comments

I finally received a verbal offer after 3 and a half months from my first on-site. The interview was originally for L4 but they down leveled to L3 and currently, they are not hiring L3s, so it would probably take a few months to match with a team. The recruiter said they are having the worst time in terms of hiring.

About the offer, it would probably be in San Bruno with about 200k TC. They would increase the TC if I have a competing offer but not sure how much.

What do you think about the offer? Do you know if there is a cap for L3 TC? I have a couple of interviews coming up so I might get other offers. I really like Google but it is taking so long and I am kind of disappointed with the downlevel after about 4-5 months process. Please let me know if you have any advice.

I have a Ph.D. with 3 YOE

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TOP 79 Comments
  • IBM / Eng
    hashClash

    IBM Eng

    BIO
    Install Gentoo
    hashClashmore
    Apply to other companies and use the Google offer as leverage. Don't take it. Imagine doing a PhD to be at the same level as some UCLA bro who grinded leetcode for a week
    May 30 10
    • IBM / Eng
      hashClash

      IBM Eng

      BIO
      Install Gentoo
      hashClashmore
      Just because it isn't happening right now doesn't mean it won't happen in the future. God speed anon
      May 30
    • Okta doll$h
      Or a person who just finished finished a 3 month coding bootcamp and being leveled as same. Get more offers and use G as leverage
      May 30
    • OP
      @doll$h is Okta hiring? I am trying to apply for the Toronto branch
      May 30
    • Okta doll$h
      Expanding big time in Toronto. DM!
      May 30
    • OP
      DMed :)
      May 30
  • Facebook ⭕w⭕
    May 30 3
    • OP
      hahahaha, I have watched that show, it feels exactly the same
      May 30
    • Salesforce explorer10
      Which show ?
      May 30
    • OP
      Pawn Stars, it's a tv show about lowballing customers
      May 30
  • Facebook megarising
    We will be really unhappy it you take L3. You will be hired at the same level as new college hire.
    May 30 5
    • OP
      I am really disappointed. I have my FB interview results coming up, wish me luck
      May 30
    • Facebook megarising
      Good luck! BTW Facebook process is much faster and they dont downlevel for no reason
      May 30
    • OP
      I really hope so. It's been two weeks from my onsite, is that normal?
      May 30
    • Facebook megarising
      Most people here in 1 week, so that's not normal, but it could just be someone was on vacation and failed to submit feedback.
      May 30
    • OP
      Thanks, I really hope I at least get this one
      May 30
  • New pbYo77
    I wouldn't take it. I think a PhD should either be getting a L4 or a top of the range L3 offer around $250K or so. If you really want Google, I would use those competing offers to push the TC. An offer from Facebook would be especially helpful. The top L3 offer I have heard of was $270K.

    Yeah, the process is quite slow and they might even push you with a deadline if you have competing offers or interviews. Have you mentioned to your recruiter about these other interviews?
    May 30 14
    • Google / Eng AstroTelr
      Don't take unless L4. You can't easily get promoted to L4 from L3 in < a year, although the recruiter would like you to believe
      May 31
    • New pbYo77
      @AstroTelr How long does it usually take?
      May 31
    • Google / Eng AstroTelr
      18 months if you do well. If you are supposed to be L5 but got as L3 your manager can fight in ¹ year, but that means your manager should be awesome and you must be showing signs of performance at L5
      May 31
    • OP
      @AstroTelr that's exactly what my recruiter said. He said we like to hire as lower levels and promote them fast. He said even 6 months is possible. So disappointing to hear even that's a lie
      May 31
    • New pbYo77
      Yeah, I expected that. Don't trust recruiters anyways. I heard L4 to L5 takes 2 to 3 years.
      May 31
  • Amazon
    ammo

    Amazon

    PRE
    Amazon, Salesforce, Google, Microsoft, Apple
    ammomore
    Google is digging its own grave ⚰️⛏️
    May 30 1
    • Google ahx
      the interview process here has always sucked, both for the interviewers and the interviewees. not sure why it's still not fixed.
      May 30
  • Google ahx
    PhD and 3 yoe, yeah they are lowballing you dude. Which company did you work at? How well did you do in interviews? Definitely interview at other tech cos.
    May 30 7
    • OP
      Thanks, I guess so. I wanted to convince myself that it is not that bad but from reactions here, I guess it's hopeless
      May 30
    • Alibaba vjqX22
      Yeah - the fact that you had a second round of interview proves that you had many red flags, and they need a second round to make sure you’re a good candidate.

      That explains why you got a L3.

      Regarding the offer: 200 is a middle range offer. I think you can push to 230~240 if you negotiate.

      Is this position for MTV?

      Best of luck!
      May 31
    • OP
      Apparently, I almost got the L4 offer the first round and there was a long debate over it. The second interview was a mess, the interviewer was 15 minutes late and I was unlucky with the question. Anyways, not important. This procedure changed my view about Google, I'm not excited to work for them anymore
      May 31
    • Alibaba vjqX22
      Yeah - but that isn’t related to google only. All the interview processes I’ve ever participated had some sort of “luck” factor.

      But don’t give up that easy!
      May 31
    • OP
      I do not appreciate the down leveling at the end. not all companies do that. I really liked to work at Google and I have no regret about rejecting my other offer because of that, but I don't know if I would be happy at Google knowing that I am working at a junior level and I am not appreciated by my employer. That was one of the main reasons that I liked Google in the first place.
      May 31
  • Apple / Eng srand()
    PhD doesn’t add anything unless it is relevant to the field. Degrees are not magic potions. The interview and your experience has much bigger impact on your offer. Maybe you didn’t go that well on the interview to build up leverage?
    May 30 4
    • OP
      I have a PhD in computer science. My field of research was shortest path algorithms and route planning which would have been a great match with Google Map teams. I had 2 hard and 3 medium questions for my first interview which I solved/coded optimally. I just got some hints for the hard ones.
      May 30
    • Apple / Eng srand()
      If you did that well on the interview and your research was that impressive you wouldn’t be low balled. I am not trying to diminish you, but what it comes down is your market worth. Maybe Google valued you lower than you are. Or maybe they analyzed that you are willing to “pay a premium” to work for them because you might not get another exciting offer anytime soon. How desirable are you in the market? A way to prove your value is by having competing offers.
      May 30
    • OP
      Yeah i wonder that too. The only way to know is to apply for more jobs and see what happens. I already rejected one because of google but it wasn't a great offer. I'll see what happens next
      May 30
    • Apple / Eng srand()
      Yeah, I would do that too. It’s hard to define the best strategy: to accept a Google low baller and wait and see if you get adjusted, or to go somewhere else on a better offer. Good luck.
      May 30
  • New timber
    Ask them to go f u ck themselves. Absolutely do not take the offer and instead continue interviewing elsewhere. When interviewing at other places tell them you have Google offer
    May 30 3
    • LinkedIn stuffy🐷
      Not a good idea. That could get you blacklisted.
      May 30
    • New timber
      You will get blacklisted, if you accept offer and then reject it. I am not asking op to accept or reject
      May 30
    • LinkedIn stuffy🐷
      I was referring to “go f u ck themselves”
      May 30
  • Amazon alexus
    I kinda understand your feelings about G. I always wanted to work at G and even if I get an L3 offer I'd still go try it for one year (until that mindset of "I finally made it to G" is satisfied) and then leave.
    May 30 0
  • Rockwell Automation / Cust. Srv. peanut b
    I will at the least negotiate on the level. Because going into the company a level down than what you originally wanted might not help you in the long run (esp job satisfaction part).

    200K total compensation sounds reasonable. Based on your experience and a PhD
    May 30 1
    • OP
      I think the level is not negotiable
      May 30
  • New / Eng hellllooo
    Did they say the would "increase TC if you got a competing offer"? If so that's an awful strategy on their part and makes it clear you're worth more to them. Get another offer and don't look back.
    May 30 0
  • Gap / Eng randUser
    Oh shit if you decline the offer can you let me know what team? I'm trying to find a team with L3 openings 😭😭
    May 30 6
    • Gap / Eng randUser
      Just a month and a half but sounds like the recruiter is leaning towards not looking anymore
      May 30
    • New pbYo77
      Did they tell you that? Someone else told me their recruiter expects headcount to replenish in August
      May 31
    • Gap / Eng randUser
      They told me that but also told me to reinterview and aim for a higher level in August.. I only have 2 YOE I doubt I'll get L4 lmao
      May 31
    • New pbYo77
      @randUser I was in the same situation but got a friend at Google to refer me to her HM. Is that a possibility?
      May 31
    • Gap / Eng randUser
      I would love that. But I'm in the Midwest and none of my friends work for Google :/ so I have like no connections 😭
      May 31
  • Overstock.com uDuA52
    200 TC is BS in Bay Area.
    Jul 10 4
    • Oath hmmuutr
      As in too low?
      Jul 10
    • Overstock.com uDuA52
      Yes, I think it is too low. I forgot the experience levels. I apologize. He is 3 years of experience. May be good number. I wouldn’t move to Bay Area unless it is 300+
      Jul 10
    • Oath hmmuutr
      Yea I learned that the hard way. I moved to bay area for around 125K comp. Just salary and bonus. No stocks. Boy was that stupid. After taxes not much is left.

      I took a low offer because I didn't really research the bay area market well and relocated from East coast where my salary was much lower.

      My company later finally gave me some stocks after realizing I had some worth I guess. But it was too late. I found a new gig that's going to give me around 300K in TC
      Jul 10
    • Overstock.com uDuA52
      That is great man. I don’t think it is a bad idea to move to Bay Area and search for other opportunities though. Like in my case, I was neither contacted by Apple nor they responded to my requests. The only companies contact me or responded are FB, Amazon, Netflix and some decent companies. You will have better chance if you live in the area.
      Jul 10
  • Amazon mdllgo
    3 months?! You're kidding?! Then how people get their offers in 2 weeks?!
    Which location is that? California?
    May 30 1
  • VMware / Eng
    vLol

    VMware Eng

    PRE
    Wayfair
    vLolmore
    What's your current TC? Did you give them your numbers?
    May 30 1
  • FileMaker / IT Hawas
    How was the interview in terms of leetcode hard and medium?
    May 30 1
    • OP
      mostly mediums and some hards
      May 30
  • Oath hmmuutr
    Same thing happened to me. Except my recruiter didn't really tell me the whole time I was down leveled. I only officially figured it out after I was offered very low comp at L3. They already knew I had competing offers.

    After putting them on blast for the low numbers, they upped stock a lot but salary only a little bit. I declined.

    I didn't really pass HC though. I got put on hold. Process sucks
    Jun 3 0
  • Rockwell Automation / Cust. Srv. peanut b
    It is not so much about PhD. I think it is a “recruitment trap” for lower salary negotiation when they post for a level above and then they tell you that it is currently not available and only that specific lower level role is available. I have experienced this and it could be mainly due to that department budget issue. Who knows?!

    PhDs with 3 years of experience with a total comp of 200K is okay (Bay Area salaries do not really correlate to expense here). Yes, I will definitely bring up the salary.
    May 31 0