Immigration

Dec 26, 2017 167 Comments

I am curious about Americans view on legal immigration - especially the ones against it. Immigrants have been such as asset to this community and I feel the backlash towards legal immigrant community has been due to other systemic factors and govt failures wrt to education and healthcare. Economic distress leading to populist uprising. Some facts we all know are true
1. US is an aging population (like Canada and other Western Europe countries) Demographers are freaking out as it reached its historic low in July this year. It means US needs immigrants and productive young workforce so that it can sustain its taxes, medicare & social security benefits (meant only for citizens - very conditional for immigrants). Legal immigrants fill that gap well. If that is stopped, quite obvious Greece will happen in 20 years. Do you want your SS and MC to be screwed in 20 years?
2. Legal immigrants contribute upto 1 billion of social security and medicare taxes. 37% of silicon valley workers are immigrants. Not only do they pay high taxes but also contribute to trickle down economy since they call US their home.
3. The best and the brightest get attracted to American dream. How will US benefit if they give the message “well US doesnt care and you are not welcome”?
4. 40% colleges have already seen a dip in their international admissions this year. Reasons being anti immigrant sentiment coupled with competition from Canada & Australia. Is that good?
5. How will stopping/curbing legal immigration create more jobs? Why wont profit mongers like Fb/Google just move jobs to location outside US with better talent and low pay? We see that, dont we? When an employee’s visa expire in big companies, the employee is transferred to Canada/China/India, have never seen that position being backfilled in US. US loss - point 2 above. Also, there are enough jobs for everyone and unemployment rates are dropping.
6. America has been the country of immigrants and has benefitted tremendously. Do you want that definition to change with protectionist and non competitive policies?

P.S: Lets for a moment pass the arguments on legal immigration abuse. No doubt that it should be fixed.

Just interested in big picture from your perspective if legal immigration is stopped/curbed. Should not Americans come together to fix more systemic policy gaps in higher college education (high school dropouts cannot be product managers in Fb, can they?)and medical instead of backlashing legal immigrants?

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TOP 167 Comments
  • Oracle P:3dfEr
    Republicans or trump supporters want to allow legal immigration as long as you are white. That is the current reality.
    Dec 26, 2017 13
    • Oracle P:3dfEr
      OP what are you? Your motivation is now important since you deny something that has been proven over and over.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • OP
      I never intended this thread to be about Trump, rather learn more abt what a hardworking civil American thinks. Already mentioned tht current administration give “anti immigrant” vibes.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • OP
      @P:3 : How does that matter? Didnt want this to become racism discussion. We all know current administration can be very insane. Wanted a platform for healthy discussion, not abt Trump. But doesnt look like thats possible.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle P:3dfEr
      You wanna talk about immigration but not racism. How does that work? It’s like talking about sandwiches but not peanut butter and jelly.

      Current state of this country, you wanna talk about immigration? It will not be healthy. Trump supporters have come out under the rock and shown their true colors. Immigration and racist nazism are on the same agenda.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • OP
      I want us to look at the bigger picture. Most Trump supporters don’t wake up wanting to throw immigrants out. They want a better life for their family and kids just like you. Step in their shoes, they dont know how to send their kids to college, or have a decent medical facility with paycheck to paycheck. The politics fed them that immigrants took away jobs. Most Americans make for one of the most accepting communities. Propaganda is everywhere, doesnt represent everyone.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      There are too many hyper emotional irrational immigrants on blind to have a rational, civil, and honest discussion about legal immigration.

      They are blinded by their emotions and self interest. It has placed them into a position where legal immigration is a binary issue.

      Either you are for lots and lots of legal immigration, OR you're 100% against it (and you're racist because you only want white people).
      There is no in between.

      And this is obviously a completely irrational and unreasonable position.

      I voted for Trump and would do it again.
      I mostly support his positions on immigration.

      And I think our immigration system is totally fucked, and needs to be massively reformed.
      H1B needs to be drastically reformed.
      Highest wages should be given top priority.
      Minimum wage should be 100k.
      H1B should NEVER be approved for entry level positions nor for level 1 or level 2 wages.
      All H1Bs should be direct hires - consultancies are banned from using H1B.

      The US immigration should only be merit based... Based on a points system.
      no more diversity visa
      no more chain migration

      I support immigration to the US 100%, without regard to race.
      Buy there must be smart and measured immigration policy, and it should always be for the best interest of the US.

      White, black, or brown -- the merit based immigration policy should pay no regard to an individual's race.

      The interests of immigrants should never ever ever be placed above the interests of citizens.

      The interests of citizens should ALWAYS have higher priority.

      Please point out to me which points above are unreasonable or racist.
      And why.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle P:3dfEr
      You lost me on voting trump. Voting trump makes you a racist. Period. You can’t just pick some of his politics and ignore others. You, in my book, a pure racist. I know you won’t care.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Microsoft seemsfastr
      @P:3dfEr, you are the hardcore racist here. You seem so full of hatred. The fact that you believe 100% of Trump supporters and Republicans want only whites to be around is blindly ignorant
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      @P:3
      Hahaha


      Case in point.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon / Product FuckObama
      Those comments on Haiti and Nigeria were from 1 unnamed source at the meeting and a 2nd unnamed source who heard about it. Don't fall for unverified stories so easily.
      Dec 27, 2017
  • Amazon / Eng
    Hooliganss

    Amazon Eng

    BIO
    Engineer at AWS
    Hooliganssmore
    People are against legal immigration?
    Dec 26, 2017 12
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      The percentage of US citizens that are actually completely against legal immigration is probably something like
      .001%

      Hardly anyone is actually entirely against legal immigration.

      It's just a "straw man" argument.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      @Hooliganss

      Yep.
      That's what I see too.
      With myself, as a Trump voter as well as others.

      Nobody is against legal immigration. We just want it reformed and based on merit.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Actually Trump voters say idiotic things like legal immigrants take jobs from Americans and drive down wages. Heard it here many times.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      More than just Trump voters say this.

      ---------------
      What would happen if the H1B annual limit (new visas) was increased to 300k? (Tech Lounge)
      https://us.teamblind.com/s/LcLBm6pH
      --------------


      I see a number of people agreeing that cranking up the h1b limit to 300k per year would depress tech salaries.

      So....... They're all trump voters?
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      What’s important is not so much the number, but the wage. The wage floor should be increased from 60K to ~100K and adjusted for inflation. With the new wage floor, the shortage of available visas will magically disappear and the current numbers will work just fine.

      Also, get rid of the lottery system and just sort applicants in decreasing order of salary (highest first), using age as a tiebreaker if there’s a cluster around the cutoff.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle 08bggdt
      Agreed.
      AND adjusted for inflation.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      A points system shouldn't only look at employment and salary. Points should be given for:

      - being young (under 35)
      - bringing young children with you
      - every degree completed: bach, master, phd
      - extra points for a US degree
      - extra points for a worldwide top 100 college
      - fluency with English
      - having relatives in the US
      - having immediate family in the US
      - having an American act as a sponsor
      - having 5+ years of professional experience
      - having US work experience
      - having a job offer
      - having an offer with a high salary
      - being a member of a desired occupation

      Award points for all those things, weighed appropriately, and then stack rank by points and award visas to the people at the top.

      A professional with family in the US is more desirable than one without, somebody offering to cover the cost of any welfare in the first seven years demonstrates a safety net, and so on. Somebody with advanced degrees in a desired field but no current job offer may be a better addition then someone with less education but who somehow got as higher salary offer.

      But all these factors should be added together and visas awarded to the best, or to everyone who gets more points than some cutoff threshold.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      I think the top 100 college thing, which is also super subjective, also becomes irrelevant if they have a well paying job offer. Sounds good though.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Actually it doesn't because the top 100 college guy might work in non tech and yet be a better addition to the US than a highschool dropout who studied leetcode and got into Facebook.

      For example many scientific researchers are paid less than software developers. Salary is not the only measure of worth.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Google / Eng
      eYiX63

      Google Eng

      PRE
      Airbnb
      eYiX63more
      They should raise the minimum salary for H-1 visas to 200k. Most larger companies can afford that
      Dec 27, 2017
  • SAP Vegasli
    Good to see everyone in favor of legal immigration. However a reform is much needed esp to contain the abuse. Wonder what are your views on spousal GCs? About a quarter of all GCs goto immigrants who married citizens. They are not necessarily skilled or pay taxes like a lot of high skilled legal immigrants do for years!
    Dec 30, 2017 62
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      What is that, 5 responses now and still not able to answer a really simple question. I kind of see how politicians are able to dance around questions. Anyways, cheers! Have a good night!
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      That’s #6! No response. Dance boy!
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      Please answer the very simple question I posed. It’ll help me learn your angle. Thanks!
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      Are we deleting comments now? ;)
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      4 deleted comments, 9 comments without answering the question. :D
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      5 deleted, 10 comments.
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      6 deleted, 11 comments.
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      7 deleted, 11 comments.
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon eek a 🐁
      ^^^ troll still refusing to learn economics

      No comments are being deleted, I just keep moving this one to the bottom.
      Jan 2, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng
      Hooliganss

      Amazon Eng

      BIO
      Engineer at AWS
      Hooliganssmore
      8/13
      Jan 2, 2018
  • Apple GuerreroSt
    Because:
    (1) Not all legal immigration is people who have valuable skills. The diversity lottery hands 50,000 green cards every year. The only requirement is that applicants have finished high school. Wtf?

    (2) 70% of legal immigrants use family connections rather than being evaluated directly on their merit. While obviously people should be able to bring their spouse and kids with them, there should be restrictions on other types of relatives.

    (3) The legal H-1B system is being abused a lot. There are basically no repercussions as long as you pay a salary of $60K which is hilariously low. See the Disney and Southern California Edison layoffs, for example.

    (4) People who are waiting for green cards, and currently on H-1B’s, have difficulty switching jobs. If a significant minority does not have the freedom to switch jobs, it depresses wages for everyone.
    Dec 26, 2017 11
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      (1) Yeah, fuck that. Should be merit based. Given the long lines your coworkers from India/China are enduring, I can’t believe you’re against moving these 50K into the merit based pool.
      (2) Sure, so give elderly parents visas. That’s already in the RAISE Act proposal.
      (4) Not so easily if you also have a green card pending, because switching jobs can endanger your place in line. Especially for engineer -> manager hires/promotions. So yes you can stay on H-1B, but the prospect of losing your green card place in line is an effective deterrent.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      As long as the company has an inordinate amount of power over a significant minority of employees (eg. we can fire you tomorrow and you’d have to relocate your family to another country... unless you find another job very very soon, that would be a real shame, so you better be happy at your current pay), wage depression will continue.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • OP
      You are not able to look beyond the technicality of your immediate self interest and you expect the whole American immigration system to change exactly and only the way it benefits you? Get the drift?
      Not denying that GC backlog is a fuck up which should be fixed.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      So... given all the problems you acknowledge in the current system of H-1B’s, green cards, and too much family-based immigration, I’m not entirely sure what your point is.

      You seem to oppose any change that improves the system unless you agree with it 100%?
      Dec 26, 2017
    • OP
      My point is - the post is not about technical challenges in legal immigration processes. Lets not digress.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      I get it. You support a hypothetical version of immigration that works perfectly and only racists can possibly be against.

      You won’t be able to make immigration work unless you’re willing to acknowledge all its effects in the real world, good and bad. Go back to tumblr and twitter.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Cisco / Eng Mylady
      The point of the visa is to be temporary. Would you like your 80 years old mother that requires care to go back to a different country? Germany has a similar immigration policy and I know quite a few talented engineers who preferred US because they needed an opportunity to bring their parents over when they age. And I know a couple of Indian families who had to go back to India and take their kids away from their schools and friends, because they couldn't bring parents over due to the long wait. This is an important factor and as OP mentioned there is a competition for the top talent. Top talented people can be paid a lot but they won't be able to buy their parents a greencard, there is just no way for that. Similarly with the salary cap: 100K sounds reasonable for software jobs. But what about post doctoral jobs? They don't pay as much yet it is critical for US to be on the cutting edge in science.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      As for parents, it’s easy to create a visa classification for them to live with their kids in the US. This should be done. The Republican-proposed RAISE act proposes one, even.

      Post-doctoral jobs qualify for EB-2 NIW’s or potentially EB-1’s. They also qualify for cap-exempt H-1B’s if they work at a university or a nonprofit such as OpenAI.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Walmart IgVY23
      There are thousands of h1b fraud visas floating around, that’s what ruins it for the folks who work hard and want to stay
      Dec 27, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      ^ exactly. If you think legal immigration is a good thing, you should call out abuse to continue defending the integrity of the system in the public eye. Otherwise it will be voted out.
      Dec 27, 2017
  • New / Product
    Billybaby

    New Product

    BIO
    Brick n Mortar retail
    Billybabymore
    Benefits of immigration are always seen in the long run. The government and most companies (except the ones who are pro-immigration) are looking only at short run benefits, such as cost-cutting for profitability, winning rural American vote banks etc.
    Dec 26, 2017 6
    • OP
      Americans people even in rural areas deserve to know the reality, dont they? They might be rural but not stupid. Some party in politics will always try to polarize and ignite populist sentiments for easy vote bank, but citizens should see through it and come together to ask questions that matter like - What is happening with increasing tuition fees and debts for middle class American young kids who are forced to drop out. If not, be in debt forever?
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Microsoft Facts
      How is it cost cutting when my employer pays me over 150,000 in addition to all the legal fees which typically run over $10,000 every 3 years
      Dec 26, 2017
    • eBay Deeamr
      ^ becoz you generate 10x that amount as revenue for the company, need not give you big raises and will be held captive to the company due to draconian immigration rules. Big win in the long term.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Microsoft Facts
      I don't know, I get good raises. And as for the revenue generation part, the same can be said about citizens.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      ^ Microsoft how long have you worked there? No one is claiming you get paid less than your coworkers btw.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • eBay Deeamr
      Citizens are flight risk and don’t need any sponsorship from the company meaning companies holding power is reduced
      Dec 27, 2017
  • T-Mobile / Eng p021dbw32
    I think all the smartest people from all over the world should be welcomed here and given citizenship. We should take all the smartest and thrive as the greatest nation.
    Dec 27, 2017 2
  • Microsoft newyorkhky
    Am not against immigration—US has benefitted historically from drawing on non-US citizens.

    I am, however, against the system abuse (eg big consulting firms), politicians who use it as a platform for fear-mongering and the haters (you don’t like it here, go the fuck home).
    Dec 26, 2017 1
    • OP
      Abuse is the termite. Harms everyone except the big firms making 💵
      Dec 26, 2017
  • TuneIn ibelieve
    People are wary of outsiders, especially those who are very different;

    some prefer things to remain the same, and may think that's actually possible;

    on a related note, if your city is going through rapid transformation, you may feel like being alienated in your own neighbourhood, that feeling of losing your roots can be quite upsetting.
    Dec 26, 2017 1
    • OP
      Very valid perspective. However, isnt that interesting given that very “roots” is all about immigration. However, the cultural conflict will always be a major challenge I agree.
      Dec 26, 2017
  • Kaspersky Lab Rtyuip
    Well, some says that population ages because younger generations can't afford having kids, so they might be mad that goverement support immigration instead of younger Americans
    Dec 26, 2017 2
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Which is utter nonsense. But I don't doubt you that people get angry over false beliefs.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Kaspersky Lab Rtyuip
      True, well what I was trying to say that people had been angry at government for many reasons, and there are maybe a point when they are angry about everything USG does and can't think straight anymore
      Dec 26, 2017
  • Gallagher / Eng HhyD10
    The irony is that this country is almost entirely built through immigration. The majority of Americans have immigrant blood less than 3 generations ago. People just like to have something to hate and blame for the troubles in thier own lives.
    Dec 26, 2017 2
    • TuneIn ibelieve
      People just don't hold the same belief as their ancestors. Actually, I doubt the original colonists conquered America on the belief that all should be welcome to the land of free.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      @Hhy

      Correct.

      Like all of the immigrants that hate Trump for causing troubles in their lives, because he believes the interests of citizens should be placed above the interests of immigrants.
      Dec 26, 2017
  • Expedia pfender
    I mean wtf. All americans are children of immigrants. The natives are the people who should be asked this question.
    Dec 26, 2017 0
  • Sciton / Eng vecE27
    The share of non-US born residents in US has approached the historic highs. The more it goes on like that the more ethnic ghettos will be created, more interpreters will be needed for proper functioning of society, multi-language schools and other costs. It is getting harder to assimilate the growing share of immigrants to the US culture.

    The whole system should be merit-based and more favorable to skilled immigrants, rather than have more than half of the immigrants come through family connection to recently naturalized citizens, like it's happening now.
    Dec 26, 2017 14
    • Sciton / Eng vecE27
      It's a statement from Census bureau. Comprehension of that statement may cause different types of feelings, including, yes, fear, or smth else.

      I guess the percentage of non-native born may have been higher outside the range, when US census was done. But those times also had intense fightings between Natives and Europeans. Not something I'd like to see in the 21st century due to unlimited immigration and following culture clash.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Sciton / Eng vecE27
      Tourism hypothesis... interesting. Do you have data on tourism for the same years that explains the uptick in non-resident numbers?
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon / Eng ☁️isOn💽
      I think a more useful stat is how many immigrants became permanent residents over the years. Temporary residents don’t matter as they leave before they can bother Americans
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon / Eng ☁️isOn💽
      No I don’t have data on tourists. I am sure there will be something out there but I am too lazy to look for it
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Except that hasn't happened in Canada which has a higher rate of immigration per capita than the US.

      First generation immigrants often start out in insular groups, and always have. The Chinese, Italians, Irish all created little Italys and chinatowns.

      But they kids integrated, and the current wave is no different.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Sciton / Eng vecE27
      Here's 50 more years of non-native born population data from 1850.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Sciton / Eng vecE27
      Could you provide a similar data on Canada, since you mentioned?

      Yes, children of Chinese, Italians etc. indeed integrated, but that happened when immigration laws got tightened in 1870-s and then significantly in 1920-s and number of new immigrants has dropped. We are heading towards the same now. Laws will be tightened, immigration will drop (hopefully the merit-based immigrants will prevail over other types) and remaining immigrants will integrate.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      People didn't integrate because less tightened. People just integrate. Kids go to American schools and grow up far more American than their parents. The current immigrants are doing it, education rates, inter marriage rates, English proficiency rates ALL show that.

      Canadian immigration is 0.7% per year, more than double the US rate of 0.3%. Canada's target is 1% immigration per year but has missed that target and only gotten the 0.7% most years.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon / Product FuckObama
      It's not at all obvious that recent immigrants will assimilate well. First, lot of them move to areas with lot of immigrants, which significantly slows down assimilation. Second, technology enables immigrants to easily stay in touch with their home countries.
      Dec 27, 2017
    • Amazon eek a 🐁
      Didn't the Italians move into Italian areas? Seems to have worked out.
      Dec 28, 2017
  • Apple GuerreroSt
    Yeah, the article basically only mentions Directional State Universities. Boo hoo.
    Dec 26, 2017 1
    • Oracle Iiii88888
      This is a good thing for residents of the state. It will make acceptance a little bit easier.
      Dec 26, 2017
  • Expedia cLSq38
    I always take it like this. If a Chinese can do and if an Indian can do why can’t I.... rather than if a Chinese can do or Indian can do let’s not give them opportunity
    Dec 6, 2018 0
  • Amazon
    唔撚系掛

    Amazon

    PRE
    Amazon
    唔撚系掛more
    Local residents across the globe all dislike immigration unless they got something out of it, like cheaper prices, or else it is just a competition for jobs. You will always find that it is the rich who favors them and poor and middle class not so much.

    Republicans and Trump are not holier, they are just doing what the white mid Westerners and southerners wanted.
    Dec 26, 2017 0
  • Amazon 🥓 lover
    The anti family idea President Chump is pushing is ignorant. Data shows that people with family connections are the most likely to be long term successful.

    The "dey took r jabs" crowd just doesn't understand economics: immigrants create more jobs than they take.
    Dec 26, 2017 12
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      So rather than looking at immigrants from 40 years ago (your paper literally looks at the 1977 cohort), there is more recent data which does not support your hypothesis:

      http://www.ppic.org/content/pubs/jtf/JTF_ImmigrantAdmissionsJTF.pdf
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      And by the way, your paper does not support the claim that they are more likely to be long-term successful. I suspect you didn’t even read the abstract lol.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Nothing in that link added anything or contradicted anything. It looked at short term employment, the link above looked at long term.

      The question is which prepared you better for long term success: starting out with an effective social support network (close family) or starting out with a job offer on day one. In the long run they are both effective.

      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      First you said: “...people with family connections are the most likely to be long term successful.”

      Now you’re saying they are both equally effective.

      Reality is, as your linked paper found, skilled immigrants still did better in the long term but the difference narrowed over time.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      I found your paper on sci-hub. It compares skilled immigrants against spousal immigrants (not all family immigrants, just spouses). It still found a gap, just that the gap narrows over time.

      It’s important to actually read the papers you cite, bro. I continue to call BS on your claim that family connections are the most likely to be long term successful.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Family immigration also results in, guess what, children. Not only do family immigrants have higher social mobility than employment immigrants, they integrate faster and contribute more in terms of building the population and the community.

      Lots of employment immigrants actually eventually leave, taking their families, children, and savings with them. Particularly employment immigrants from backlogged countries or immigrants whose spouses are prevented from working.

      By the way I'm an employment immigrant from a non backlogged country. I am telling you the opposite of what would benefit me personally because it's the truth.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      Where do I even begin...

      Lots of citations needed for your claims of:
      (1) Family immigrants have higher social mobility
      (2) They integrate faster
      (3) They contribute more to building the population**
      (4) They contribute more to the community

      The issues such as spouses being unable to work only exist because they haven’t been given green cards yet. Also, you should consider that many of them leave not by choice, but by necessity - if you get laid off and don’t have a green card, you basically have to pack your bags.

      You sound like a total idiot btw. OMG look at this group of high-income people! They don’t have the right to permanent residence here, so they might leave eventually! The obvious solution here is to give them green cards so they have the right to remain, not to give green cards to someone else...

      In any case you haven’t provided any data to back up your claims here that employment-based immigrants who have green cards or are naturalized actually leave at a higher rate than family immigrants who have the same papers.

      [**] I actually wouldn’t be surprised if skilled immigrants have fewer children on average. Having more children is correlated with lower education and lower income levels, after all. But if this is the concern, the solution to this is more immigrants, not immigrants who produce the most kids.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Amazon 🥓 lover
      Most employment based immigrants NEVER get green cards. But it's also obvious that people with family ties are more likely to stay for the long run than people without.

      The social mobility point was mentioned in the links above.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      Then exclude them from the comparison, because temporary workers are not immigrants.

      The only people asking for more H-1B’s (as opposed to more green cards for skilled workers) are companies - not people who want to work here.
      Dec 26, 2017
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      The only thing your paper found is that spouse immigrants have a high social mobility. Which is not too surprising - associative mating etc.
      Dec 27, 2017
  • New / Product
    Billybaby

    New Product

    BIO
    Brick n Mortar retail
    Billybabymore
    There are unemployed people and there are foreign-born workers pouring in. There is definitely a skills-mismatch, although over-hyped, and there is an unwillingness to be adaptable - moving states, working hard/smart.
    Dec 31, 2017 2
    • Kaspersky Lab Rtyuip
      Another thing might be that engineering education in US cost way more than the one in another country.
      Jan 1, 2018
    • Amazon / Product Ex-Banker
      The skills mismatch is definitely overhyped. Low skilled mass immigration does hurt low skilled American workers as the latter is not able to transition into higher paying skilled jobs due to their backgrounds. In addition, low skilled immigrants are paid their marginal product, meaning that they are paid roughly the value of the goods and services they produce. Hence, there is no incremental output that will result in wage increases for Americans. Research by immigration economists such as Borjas and Hanson show that the positive economic impact of immigration is only 0.1% of GDP.
      Jan 1, 2018
  • Intel gpdshdcrd
    Merit based seems to be the most viable option, but let’s say it’s someone like Albert Einstein, then I would think we would have enough sense to know he will be coming with his family.
    Dec 26, 2017 1
    • Apple GuerreroSt
      Most discussions of merit-based immigration (including the RAISE act proposed by Republicans) have immediate availability of visas/green cards for parents, spouses, and kids.

      It’s the distant relative stuff that people are opposed to.
      Dec 26, 2017
  • Apple GuerreroSt
    Dip in international admissions is not necessarily a bad thing. Are MIT, Harvard, Stanford, Berkeley, etc having fewer international applicants?

    Or is it mostly the small-name Directional State University types, who use international students as just a cash cow?

    I’m interested in the raw data from which the 40% stat was produced.
    Dec 26, 2017 1
  • Amazon / Eng VTech Bro
    Most jobs are lost to automation.

    You cannot blame a robot taking over works that cost $70/hr after benefits and unfunded liability like the big 3 domestic auto were paying for.

    Yes it cost the Chinese $5/hr but they too will face the same issue like Japan and Taiwan do now. Most of their low skill domestic labors are imported from 3rd world on contracts. Americans cannot expect that will never happen to us. Even the Chinese and Mexican are losing jobs to robots now.

    The same reason coal will never come back. It is not cost effective when fracking makes natural gas super cheap.
    Dec 6, 2018 0
  • Expedia cLSq38
    If we say that we Americans are losing jobs because of Indians or Chinese we need to fix our problem not create problem for Indians or Chinese. This can be achieved by proper education and dedication. We need to improve that in America. No one took Mark Zubereck or Steve Jobs or Bill gates jobs. They had the dedication.
    Dec 6, 2018 0
  • Expedia cLSq38
    America is a country of immigrants. Apart from red indians every one is an immigrants. Some one came first and occupied the land and now trying to close door for others saying we do not want others is not correct. And regarding legal immigration, getting a job and being competitive in market is like running a race. America should make education easy and less costly like China or India and force students to get education. Thereby making me stronger in the race. It is not correct to slow down others so that I can win the race.
    Dec 6, 2018 0
  • Amazon / Product FuckObama
    Legal immigration should be more like Canada's point based skills system. End visa lotteries and chain migration, and raise the salary threshold for H1B visas. Doing so will reduce legal immigration from 1 million per year to low six figures. As for illegals, I'm ok with legal status in exchange for a financial penalty but no amnesty or citizenship. And make every employer use e-verify.
    Dec 27, 2017 0
  • Intel gpdshdcrd
    Americans are not ignorant that immigration done right is a blessing to any country except of course to ones that are theocracy based or purist. What I hear is push back based on allowing in people that will not assimilate and want to practice beliefs that are counter to our constitution. Of course there is also the issue of criminals that flow in we have a problem with but those rational concerns get drowned out by selfish concerns from non citizens.
    Dec 26, 2017 0

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