Did you guys read about this??? Apparently, food delivery services are paying literal pennies to their drivers/shoppers?? Is this even legal? Is this common in the industry? Does Uber Eats, Grubhub, Postmates, Caviar do this too?
- That's fine, but it's still ignorant to say "the driver is choosing this life". You can disagree with the practice of tipping and businesses taking advantage of it, but often the people being taken advantage of don't have a lot of choices.
I called you out for your entitled mindset. Love how you try to hit back with "ignorant to support the company". Nice try!Feb 85
- You are in a damn at will employment state. They actively choose to be a delivery driver for these companies. There is no slavery or a wage slavery going on.
If your argument ends at calling me entitled you haven't solved any actual problems. All you're doing is complaining that there is a problem.
- If you're "forced" to take this job that's your choice to play the game.
It's capitalism at it's finest. If someone is willing to do the work for that little then that's what the work is worth. Until it's realized that the workers control the acceptable wages then we're going to have this cycle.
Flagged by the community.
- Indeed / SalesthenetgearI work in tech sales but deliver food for Postmates for "fun" . I'm guaranteed a minimum of 4$ per delivery and then tips on top of that. They pick up the slack if the distance or wait time doesn't equate to 4$ per delivery.
Yes I make 6 figures plus and have a 50 hour a work week. So they isn't much incentive for me to do it. But let's just say I like making money while exercisingFeb 812
- Don’t tip. Death to tipping culture. Why can’t the world just be simple? $10 means $10, not $10 + fees + tips + surcharge + other bullshit.
- You ever heard of inflation? I’m guessing you aren’t an economics major.
Why tip? For better service. You see while I tip...you wait. Get it?
I will always tip. You can’t stop me...and that is essentially your problem.
Service industry people will always appreciate this.
I’m not clear though why so many people are recommending such outlandish and unrealistic solutions that will never happen.Feb 100
- It's funny - if people didn't top you realize your cost of services/goods would go up, right? People who top are artificially keeping prices lower for people who don't.
By telling people not to tip you'll whine when prices raise because they have to pay their employees more.
Spoiler: if you can't afford to tip, you shouldn't be eating out/getting delivery/whatever.
- @SQ, let them increase prices. Why do you even bother sticking up for these businesses. Tips are included in every meal in other countries lol and it is totally fine and service is still great. You don't even get public shaming and saying workers will spit in your food. Only in America.. and I'd rather the worker pay taxes on their tips too. Got to support taxation no matter which level of income you areFeb 111
- @crypt0 .....sticking up for these businesses? Have you ever valet parked your car? Why would you not tip that young person for working hard? It’s a nice friendly gesture at the very least. That’s outside of the fact that it’s simply been around since people have been parking cars.
Same goes for tending bar, waiting tables and many other service industry jobs within our culture. I get what you are saying but it’s not valid in most instances.
In others I think there is some validity but in most of those we will see automation playing a much bigger role long term.
@saghoo and everyone else
Correct me if I am wrong but, I don’t think some people understand is that min wage is different for people in some jobs because it’s natural and it’s also been tradition that the consumer tips.
“Under federal law, restaurants are required to pay delivery drivers $2.13 per hour if they utilize the tip credit, though gratuities must push each driver over the $7.25 federal minimum wage. In the event that the $7.25 hourly rate is not met on a workweek basis, an employer must make up the difference.”
So generally speaking ...I show up with your pizza making 2.13 thinking you are going to tip me but you think I make 7.25 and believe tipping is not your responsibility.
Maybe this is why we keep going back and forth?
- Uber gatopan@dvaN82
There is the problem , why would I have to give money to someone just for doing their job. They’re hired to do so
And as you said , you cannot stop me from not tipping 🤷♂️
You guys literally sound like someone in a cucked relationship trying to justify why they’re doing the right thing
It’s abusive dude , make the restaurants pay what’s fair for labor , it works everywhere else, why not hereFeb 112
- Gusto 🙇💥☠️💀Death@dvaN82 “Why tip? For better service”
Did you even read my post above?
I mentioned that there are many countries such as Singapore and Japan where tipping is looked down and yet the service is top notch compared to the US. Even in some poorer countries like Indonesia, you get better service without tipping.
Do you have study that show that tipping WILL equal better service?
Go to Chick-fil-a or In-n-Out or talk to the employees (and ex-employees). They don’t get tips but they provide top notch service and generally are happier. Their work is more demanding too compared to the server. Try standing in front of the grill, running around making food and shakes for 7 hours (1 hour is for lunch, break, etc). Server don’t make the food, so they don’t stand in front of the grill.
So my recommendation is the same: increase the server wage from $2 to $15 hour plus benefit and abolish tipping.
Tipping actually reduce wage, since companies like DoorDash can pay their gig-worker next to nothing and have the consumer pay the difference.
The federal laws that allow min wage of $2.13 for worker that receive tips need to be abolished, just like back when min wage was $4.25. Today, many states have min wage that is equal to $10 or more. Some cities like SF have $15 min wage and even mandate healthcare.
But like you said, you’ll keep tipping and no one is going to stop you. That’s not the intent here. We’re discussing why the tipping culture should be changed for the good of the worker.Feb 113
- @dvaN82: tip for better service? That's bull shit. They should be doing great service regardless! What is a job?? They do their job, they get paid. They do bad job, they should be fired. Workers with good ratings from customers get bonuses. This will encourage customers to give rewards through reviews on good workers. Not be encouraged to do a better job to get good tip... Stop trying to support business and brain washing people to tip to subsidize workers pay. Read deaths post! He makes good points about chick fila and In n out workers. They have good pay and benefits. They always have excellent service without tip because they already get paid well by the business!
@death: exactly! I love in n out. Always Excellent service. They don't get tip, but the employee get good pay and benefits package.Feb 112
- Postmates GVrX00Postmates doesn’t use tips to calculate base pay. We don’t even ask the customer to include tip until the delivery is complete.
- eBay seatmoreSounds like what’s happening is that tips are used to subsidize guaranteed earnings. So if two people work a similar number of hours but one gets a lot of tips and the other doesn’t, their end pay is similar. I think
- Fuck tipping to make up the slack. Just don't use the services. Starve these companies out.
- Postmates j☀️What else to expect from DoorTrash. They always copy features from other competitors. This must've been copied from instacart. They have zero originality.
- The tipping culture is a crazy idea in its entirety. Tipping should be totally optional. If you’re happy with your server, pay a tip, otherwise just don’t. Servers/dispatchers frowning upon people who pay a low tip is kinda crazy. I was a student once and was not financially stable to afford a tip; still had to give it. The CEOs and businesses who make servers depend on tips instead of a regular paycheck are the ones who should be frowned upon. Death to the fuckin tipping culture.
- Instacart carrotcodeInstacart fixed this: https://techcrunch.com/2019/02/06/instacart-ceo-apologizes-for-tipping-debacle/
Tips are not a part of Instacart earnings anymore
- Fixed something that shouldn’t have been broken in the first damn place!?
Maybe if you would have cared enough to talk to your employees BEFORE it became a big issue covered by the news would have been a better strategy?
Basically, who cares if you fixed it. This is a common occurrence and nobody cares until the public finds out.
- New TKpg12They literally take money from tips given through the app.
This issue has been buzzing around online forums for ages, people just stunned that they could do this to drivers - it's awesome to see they were finally called out on it.
- GrubHub rWWQ30From what I skimmed from the article they had a hard ceiling to what the drivers could make. Where as we have a guaranteed minimum rate that the drivers earn with no ceiling.
- I'm curious, instacart/doordash run in losses, the delivery folks don't make money, Uber/Lyft lose money per ride .. who's making money again?
- Yeah, so livable wages are needed for every job and we can get rid of tipping.
Tipping sucks from both customer and worker sides — but not the boss’ side.
- Amazon 46+2Doordash are a bunch of fucking thieves. The other day I was comparing menus from Doordash and GrubHub for a specific restaurant, and found Doordash charging a dollar or two more for the same item. They are sneaky though, not doing it for every restaurant. Stopped using it.
- Google usurperThe new thing to do here is put down 22 cents as a tip in the app, then tip the driver in cash directly. The 22 cents signals to the driver that you'll tip in cash, so they don't spit in your food.
- NewRelic first ¹Tipping is like paying ransom to the employers who don't pay their own employees living wage. BTW, why people are not outrageous about some CEO, on his/her first working day of 2019, already made a whole year of employee's salary. And ppl here debating on if these employees should pay $5 or $9 tip for their food dispatcher?
- Yes, I have the same thoughts. Brainwashed people think people need to tip lol but when you are tipping, you are allowing the fucked up company to be like it is. They just need to pay decent wages for people. I hope for $15 minimum wage in the near future for these workers
- Microsoft nodaddyI think the rest don't do that shit. But regardless it's luck of the draw, they can make anywhere from 5 to 20 dollars per hour.
- Tip your goddam delivery drivers this is just how it is. If you don't like it then get up and get your food yourself or do a pickup.
This is not hard. If you can't afford it don't try to buy it.
- Not the poster. Really the issue will continue to persist with these workers and a lot business use tipping, pay under the minimum.
Maybe we should encourage people who are out of college to not work these dead end jobs.
Personally I'd rather encourage people to be involved in trade jobs rather than sticking to these. Hell maybe even getting trade schools to do more outreach.
- @voLL87: exactly, these jobs are meant for college or high school students. Temporary. Why the fuck are you trying to raise a family without a solid/growth career? People make their life decisions to have kids with a low income job and it shouldn't be customers problem. Why do we need to reward their messing up. And there is government assistance if they are low income and need help. They get housing and food stamps. They don't need to own an iPhone, BMW and other stuff they don't need.
- DoorDash and UberEats add extra $1 or $2 per dish we order. On top of this, they add several taxes and service charge. Which many of us not aware. And we can’t trust their apps that our entire tip goes to hardworking drivers. I always tip cash when they deliver food at door. Before these apps, we use to go and pick ourselves. Now we are getting lazy and making these companies rich but not the one who prepares or delivers food. It’s a crazy world!
- The race to monetize a viable "gig economy" marketplace ignores the basic fact that maybe... Just maybe... There's a reason these areas were never "things" before. And maybe they aren't exactly economically viable!
I give you Uber... If the vc's weren't heavily subsidizing each and every ride... They all would be out of business. I love the service... And quite frankly we need that with taxis. But there's a reason private cars cost what they do... And why taxis cost what they do. Years from now Uber will be seen as it is... A false construct that bankrupted taxi drivers all over the place... Robbed cities of tax revenue, created streets that were demonstrably less safe and wreaked havoc on local traffic and urban planning.
- Sarcasm notwithstanding... The damage that has been done to the economy is going to be studied for years. Disruption is great... But companies pretending to be a real viable business and doing so at a colossal loss for years is exactly how businesses ARE NOT supposed to exist.
Don't get me wrong... I love the services... But I'm not blind to the damage being done to the economy.
And how vigorously Uber is fighting to NOT have to play under the same rules.
That's not innovation... That's bullshit.
- Uber is a marketplace that connects the service providers with those who need the service. It does so efficiently within the SLA expectations of the consumers. Much more so than existing options. That's a sustainable business model.
I agree with you that subsidising the service provider-consumer match is a losing idea. I assume the Uber management understands this as well. Their solution seems to be to find even more efficiency and some profits when operating at scale. The two ways Uber seems to be trying to achieve profitable scale is via higher service provider acquisition and higher service demand. These efforts pay out in the longer term when the cost of acquisition becomes less. As long as the operating cost is not being subsidized, there's a chance of making a profit.
- But ignoring Uber... My initial point was that the quest to untold riches by attempting to monetize everything is absurd. Many of these businesses didn't exist as there was no sustainable or more importantly PROFITABLE path. And the promise of success has sent people flocking to them. And then after 6 months of losing their shirts... Realize that this was a bad idea.
- Not saying that isn't so. Clearly the world of opportunities is vast. But just like the heady days off the original valley bubble we are seeing totally untenable business models getting vast amounts of money thrown at them by vc's who go mental when they hear gig economy in a pitch deck.
- Instacart bgrishenkoTheres guaranteed earnings on batches less than $10. Problem came when batch was say $6, customer tips $6, instacart would keep the $4 and only give $2 to you and apply that $4 to raise the batch min. Basically like the restaurant industry.
Changes were made though, now 100% of tips go to shoppers without batch adjustment and all adjusted tips are being back payed to shoppers.
- It's not nuts. But it is out of control. In the us, FOOD SERVICE WORKERS have a minimum wage of about 2.60$/hour. Worth the assumption that tips make up the living wage. So the 15%...20%... That is what the actual cost is.
The crappy part is that it's carried through to everywhere else.
But the us overall is a fucked up system