Job Offer from Microsoft

Amazon / Eng 2🍕
Feb 23, 2018 38 Comments

My friend recently got an offer from Microsoft for an SDE position. She has 3 years prior experience working in a finance company as an SDE.

The recruiter gave a verbal offer & said a written offer will be given only after a verbal approval from the candidate. The recruiter also said that she can not disclose the level in which she is being considered for the job. The interview rounds are cleared, and my friend also had a conversation with hiring managers, and found a team that is a mutual fit.

Is it normal for the recruiter to not reveal the hiring level to the candidate?
The compensation numbers also seem lower than the market, especially with 3 years prior work experience. Are these numbers the norm @ Microsoft.

Base: $115k
Signing bonus: $15k
Stocks: $20k over 4 years

There are no other competing offers at the moment. Any ideas on how she can proceed with the salary negotiations?

comments

Want to comment? LOG IN or SIGN UP
TOP 38 Comments
  • Microsoft BmGW50
    A typical lvl 60 offer.
    Feb 23, 2018 4
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Is there a chance to negotiate for L61, on the basis of SDE 1 vs SDE 2?
      Feb 23, 2018
    • Microsoft BmGW50
      Tough to negotiate without a competing offer. U might try to get more signup or even rsu but base salary is tough.
      Feb 24, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Yeah, thought so. Thanks
      Feb 25, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bifxv
      Stocks and signing should be easy to give a bump to. I wouldn't expect more on base, though.

      Also, for industry hire, the stocks are considered good. Most industry hires get paltry stocks unless they are a rockstar, competing offers, and coming in at a higher level.
      Feb 27, 2018
  • Expedia adexp85
    Looks like level 60 (SDE1)
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Microsoft / Product SlowLife
    Not having another offer doesn’t mean she doesn’t have any leverage. Being a female engineer means that she is more coveted and can negotiate with that in mind. She should try to get $25k signing bonus/$40k in stock.

    As a lvl 60, she won’t get a huge amount of stock in her yearly refresher, but the extra sign on amount will keep her motivated as she gets promoted to a level. Microsoft weights comp towards cash for lower levels and changes the mix toward stock as the levels progress. I don’t know what lvl 60 stock refreshers are currently, but the amount is pretty low. I was a high-level performer @ 60 and got ~$7k a few years back.

    New grads do tend to get much more in signing bonus and stock, but that’s life.

    With all that said, this is a decent offer, and she’ll benefit from having Microsoft on her resume. Microsoft is a great place to work, and the shift toward cloud-based businesses is opening up lots of opportunities for folks who are hungry to make an impact. It’s great that she is bringing outside industry experience. If she comes to Microsoft for 1-2 years, learns a ton and has impact, she’ll get promoted fairly quickly, and she can move to another tech company if she wants. I’m guessing Microsoft is a step up from where she is currently, and if she’s not happy with the compensation compared to what she could get at other tech companies, she’ll be able to move fairly easily.
    Feb 25, 2018 2
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Thanks for the advice, seems really helpful. I'll communicate this to her.

      The recruiter seems to be pushing her to accept the offer quickly (within a day or 2 since the offer was communicated to her).

      Is this normal at Microsoft, or is the recruiter trying to avoid salary negotiations and/or not have her interview with other companies?
      Feb 25, 2018
    • Microsoft / Product SlowLife
      It really depends on the situation. The recruiter might want to move on to a secondary candidate if your friend doesn’t want to accept. It’s always risky to negotiate without another offer, and it’s hard to know what’s going on on the other side of the negotiation. I also don’t know what your friend told the recruiter about her current compensation, etc. to know what kind of negotiating power your friend has.
      Feb 26, 2018
  • Microsoft Jxuebsj
    Prob 59
    Feb 23, 2018 2
    • Microsoft / Eng CrashOverr
      With that base it could be 60
      Feb 23, 2018
    • Microsoft / Eng bks
      definitely 60
      Feb 24, 2018
  • Salesforce HooplaForx
    The level really should have been given. Offer looks 60.
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Yahoo / Eng annonhoo
    Is it normal for recruiters to send written offer letter only after the candidate verbally accepts the offer?
    Feb 23, 2018 6
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      I myself heard this for the first time. Thanks for confirming @HooplaForx
      Feb 23, 2018
    • Amazon Inspiredd
      Pretty normal. When I got an offer from Microsoft, the recruiter wouldn’t share written until I verbally accept. The recruiter did share my level and I did negotiate both level and total package.
      I see a lot of room for negotiation. This looks like a new grad offer. Lowball for sure.
      Feb 24, 2018
    • Amazon Inspiredd
      Oh and I didn’t have a competing offer. Don’t listen to people who say you can’t negotiate without a competing offer. Not true.
      Feb 24, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      @Inspiredd Thanks for the advice.
      From your experience, any tips for level negotiations?
      Feb 25, 2018
    • Amazon Inspiredd
      Highlight your experience and your leadership in your current team. If you close to a promo, mention that you are risking a promo. That worked for me
      Feb 26, 2018
  • Microsoft Jxuebsj
    Another post has L61 making 110k. So comparing to that she’s ahead.
    Feb 23, 2018 3
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Which post is it?
      Feb 23, 2018
    • Microsoft Jxuebsj
      4 months to make an impact
      Feb 23, 2018
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Thanks, Microsoft compensation model seems really weird. I understand sometimes the offer needs to be matched, but exceptions aside, I expect more or less a well defined compensation band for each level.
      Feb 23, 2018
  • Microsoft gofkurself
    No competing offer == get lowball'd
    Feb 23, 2018 1
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Is there room for negotiation still with out a competing offer?
      Feb 23, 2018
  • Cisco gh8jtv5
    "friend" ... Sure, LOL
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Microsoft / Eng Candycane
    What team? I think that makes a difference. MSIT, Finance vs Product Group. But looks like level 60.
    Feb 23, 2018 1
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      Product group
      Feb 23, 2018
  • Amazon tNJN12
    I would tell them I won’t take a job without knowing the level.
    Feb 23, 2018 1
    • Amazon / Eng 2🍕
      OP
      With no competing offer at hand, and wanting to switch companies, wouldn't this leave a risk of Microsoft backing out from the offer?
      Feb 23, 2018
  • Google crossed
    What's sde
    Feb 23, 2018 1
    • Airbnb / Eng hsock
      Software development engineer
      Feb 23, 2018
  • Microsoft / Eng
    pscy00

    Microsoft Eng

    PRE
    Morgan Stanley
    pscy00more
    Wtf your offer letter mentions your level why recruiter can disclose it.
    Feb 26, 2018 0
  • Microsoft M1-O365
    This is level 60 offer, better if it 59 so she can be promoted in a year or two. Negotiate on signing 25k and stocks 60k these are very common in offers. Don't accept low ball offer.
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Microsoft wololoooo
    Tell her to get more stocks and/or signing bonus, this is a pretty low offer for 3 years of experience.

    To give you an idea, an average offer for lvl 59 new grads without industry experience would be 108k base/70k stocks over 3.5 years/25k signing bonus. And some people can negotiate to 120k stocks without any competitng offers.

    I know Microsoft is known to be more competitive for new grads than industry hires, but your friend's offer is pretty low. And don't listen to those who say that "without competing offers you can't negotiate". This is simply not true. Starting the interview process over with other candidates would probably cost them more than negotiating a bit to make you happy.
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Microsoft / Eng psbutton
    I joined an year ago with almost the same offer. Got my socks bumped up with some negotiation. They don’t budge on base without a competing offer.
    This is most definitely level 60
    Feb 23, 2018 0
  • Amazon deegee
    Definitely SDE1. Seems semi low but experience at a non-tech company isn’t the best
    Feb 23, 2018 0

Salary
Comparison

    Real time salary information from verified employees