Given that level and comp for levels roughly match for FB & G, I wonder what people think about matching the right level and comp (I'm E5) if I want to try getting a job at Amazon/AWS and MS. At least in the case for Amazon, according to levels.fyi, there's a "hole" there between L6 and L7.
For Amazon: What do you mean by whole between Sde2 (L5) and Sde3 (L6). It looks good to me. If anything it’d be between L6-L7. For getting FB E5’s equivalent TC for the long haul, you need to be L7 at Amazon, especially if E6 promo on the horizon. However, if your E5 tc is low for any reason like internal promo or no big refreshers you can target high L6 (which can get you 380k for Seattle).
Thanks for the info! Sorry, I meant L6 and L7 for Amazon indeed, as I'm sure that getting an L7 offer at A would not be easy either. Perhaps getting a high L6 would be reasonable.
Do you plan from FB to Amazon?
If you’re really serious about making a move from F to A/M, go at least a level up. I.e. e5 -> l64/65 at microsoft or high senior/entry principal at Amazon (which I hear is extremely hard to get for external hires) Main reason is that amazon and Microsoft have negligent refreshers and your comp will more or less remain the same over 4 years
What do you recommend for FB to Goog? Fb5 —> goog 7?
Haha. Thanks for the sarcastic question :P Fb and Google have very similar levels. Actually I think it’s easier to get E5 in Fb than L5 in Google since Fb operates on timelines for promos. In Microsoft it’s easier to get to senior. In Amazon, it’s pretty much dependent on the opportunities given. Plus both of them underpay in the long run because of paltry refreshers. Getting a huge bump while joining is the better solution. And for that, it’s only possible by going up a level because for the same level, Microsoft and Amazon don’t usually beat F/G offers.
My thoughts as a former Amazon L6 and current FB E5: L6 is over-scoped in many orgs across Amazon. Instead of being a team lead as it's supposed to be (i.e. how it actually reads in the job function matrix and leveling guide), a lot of people treat it like a junior PE where you're expected to evangelize your team/product/service/API/system/whatever across an entire org, host design reviews and tech talks, work as a bar raiser, seek out $100M+ business opportunities, etc. At least, this is the case when working towards a promo or trying to get hired in from outside in the stronger orgs--once you're in role, on the other hand, you can get away without doing most of this and do just fine. In fact, there's usually enough scope in most of the larger teams (i.e. 10-14 people) to support 2 or even 3 L6 SDEs, especially if they have multiple domain verticals, but many of them actually have NONE (with a bunch of under-leveled L5s doing the work instead). I don't have a concrete explanation for it beyond a pervasive fear that the L6 bar is rapidly "dropping" (driven by Amazon's silly and unrealistic "bar raising" rhetoric), even though there's little real evidence to support that (sure, the L4 bar is pretty much gone, but that's beyond obvious and far less consequential anyhow). And the reward for all this if you push through? A bottom-of-band ~$250k. If you're performing well as a FB E5, you can easily handle the baseline L6 scope (it's not EXACTLY the same--a bit more breadth, a bit less technical depth--but close enough), but good luck getting hired at that level (or, at least, getting a high-enough-in-band offer to be remotely competitive with what FB is paying you) if you go into the interview and use a genuine narrative about what your responsibilities are. It's a sad situation, and a major reason a lot of the best talent leaves the company or rejects whatever offer they get (because they're senselessly downleveled to L5). I've heard from my friends still in the company that the people running HR/talent acquisition are aware of this and actively trying to change it, but it's going to take time if it happens at all. Unless and until that changes, I honestly wouldn't even think of bothering with Amazon unless they offer you a dream team/project opportunity--otherwise, they aren't going to match your comp (definitely won't if you take an honest appraisal of the differences in benefits and perks), and it's a generally crappier place to be anyhow.
Wonderful write up. Thank you @bCxp50!
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Career suicide or troll?
I know a FBer who recently joined Amazon so I'm quite curious (and sorry for my ignorance about A/M levels -- I'm not trolling at all =) But why do you think that it's career suicide? Any good stories to tell? Genuinely interested.