Just shutting down my startup, previously was SDE 3 at Amazon, now need to decide shall I choose PM or EM ladder. What are the pros of PM ladder w.r.t EM in your opinion? My thoughts: - Different roles w.r.t work. A personal choice. - On average PMs are underpaid vs EM. - A dev background can help me get promoted faster as EM. - After VP level, both anyway converge to a GM role. Also, can a PM move to EM roles if he later decides that its the best path for them? A little more context: - I am pretty good at tech/architecture. - Have good social skills to manage people. - Also, I am quite interested to understand business, product vision etc.
Have the same question :D wanna see what others have to say
Are you shutting down autodesk ?
EM is better. You get paid more and learn more in depth about engineering decision. PM is more about mumbo jumbo talking
Engineer's have more nuisance value. There are more opportunities for engineers. PM roles are a little too few, comparatively speaking, then again you can transfer to other industries. It's a choice of what you like to do more. Do you enjoy making decisions of the future of your product, working with people to make that vision a reality? Do you enjoy solving technical problems, implementing solutions. Both roles emphasize different skills.
Most likely, no, a PM can’t move to an EM role. Just as an architect can’t easily move to a structural engineer role. Look at it this way, an EM can “veto” anything a PM wants to do, the reverse is not true.
Uhh. Both of your statements are false in my experience. It isn’t super common for people to move between EM and PM but it certainly happens. Especially if you have the background which would allow you to do either role and decide you want to move. Also while PMs may not be able to veto directly we can usually get a project killed easier than an individual EM can if we think we gotta. An EM just makes decisions for their own team. If I see something going wrong, I’ll take it directly to their manager or a VP, and whatever VPs I need to get in a room will take my meeting to talk about it. If a line level EM wants to meet with a VP to get a decision like that, they’ll usually need to ask a PM to set it up. ;) Our power isn’t direct authority, we just chat with the people who have the direct authority about how they should use it. And we can have that chat with any exec and manager in the company about that, at any time, not just one specific management chain. So while an EM has more authority over their particular team, a PM that knows what they’re doing and is good has more influence across the entire company. And ultimately will be a major part of determining what the EMs in the company are told by their execs about what to work on.
Exactly, PM’s provide advice to the engineering management chain making the actual decisions.
PM maps to SWE. Manager of PM maps to EM
EM
If you don't mind coding / tech, stay as EM give you more option down the road with more money upfront.
EM is probably the right path for you, but fwiw, if you’re really interested in PM roles because you think those things are interesting, a solid tech background can get you noticed and promoted faster on that chain sometimes. A strong tech background for a PM can really stand out and make people take notice of your work. Whereas with an EM, everyone’s got a tech background and you’ll need something else to stand out. Then again, with strong skills that would make you successful as a PM you’ll likely stand out as an EM and without those you won’t get anywhere as a PM. So, really, IMO, chose entirely based on whether you’re more interested in managing people or product.
compensation wise there isn’t any significant difference between PM and EM.
Ehhh. I don’t think I agree with that. I’d say on average at least a 10% discount depending on the organization and how they value talent. It’s really not enough to worry about but it’s not the same comp. Which is wild since in my experience it is harder to find a good PM than a good EM! Which partly drives the idea that there aren’t any, which generally leads people to undervalue them, which generally means folks who could pick both paths pick EM... thereby making the cycle worse. :)
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Do you enjoy coding or solving engineering problems? Then it’s best to be on the EM path
A little more context: - I am pretty good at tech/architecture. - Have good social skills to manage people. - Also, I am quite interested to understand business, product vision etc.