Seattle is Dying: Your Voice, Your Future

Microsoft Hyad70
May 27 59 Comments

Great hour-long special on some local network station. Like San Francisco, Seattle with all its natural beauty is a mess due to the political policies implemented.

Folks that vote Democrat or Socialist in 2020 will knowingly or not, assure the social mess in SF and Seattle spreads to other cities across our nation.

My wife isn't from the US and was appalled at the poverty, Drugs, filth and dispare. Truly a shame.

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TOP 59 Comments
  • Facebook public2
    What's your solution? Jail everyone?
    May 27 32
    • Google Mmkaay
      Not the same thing is happening with burger flippers so your comparison is invalid. There is no such agreement between CEOs, only a huge supply of a trivial skill that will soon become entirely worthless.

      We should help these people by giving them a chance and training them to adapt by acquiring new skills that are more useful, not by giving them charity and ‘affordable housing’
      May 28
    • Oracle pzd
      Again agree with @mmkaay. With technological development, we must move our skillset upmarket. Things like government subsidy / charity are just band aids that aggravates the problem in the long run - because they delay the proper response by masking the issue. Some jobs simply deserve to be phased out, as new type of jobs are created.
      May 28
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      These tech developments deskilled jobs. Artisans has plenty it skills but when an economy industrialized then the jobs available are jobs without skills. The job market, not the quantity of skills among people, make the majority of jobs available.

      The same with fast food today - skill level is irrelevant, the jobs are made as replaceable as possible and this is why they are low paid. You might be an indispensable cook, but McDonalds rationalizes out any individual merit to turn people into cogs.

      This low pay also stifles automation because you can always lower your overhead by laying off some of the workforce and then ramping up again later... buying tech and machinery is just a dead cost, you can sell it at a loss but then you’d have to buy more to ramp up again.
      May 28
    • Apple purifier
      “Some jobs simply deserve to be phased out, as new type of jobs are created” I am pretty sure AI will start phasing out developer jobs. Popcorns are ready
      May 28
    • Google Mmkaay
      Yes, we will do our best to adapt.
      May 28
    • Oracle pzd
      @Apple ok. I don't get your point though. Are you suggesting that I should support government protection for commodity jobs because my job might get commoditized someday?
      May 28
    • Apple purifier
      @pzd teachers are not a commodity job, just like firefighters, defense, etc. they are strategic to the nation. We are a commodity job and can be easily replaced
      May 28
    • Google Mmkaay
      Teaching is not a commodity job, but if there are too many teachers then their wages will go down. It is the world’s way to tell us to focus on areas that need other set of skills, not necessarily more or less important.
      May 28
    • Oracle pzd
      Defense is pretty much the definition of commodity job
      May 28
    • Apple purifier
      I don’t really like the term commodity job. I would rather use strategic jobs, the ones that you can’t cut without have significant issues over time as a nation
      May 28
  • Credit Karma EllisDee25
    Yeah, neoliberal inequality and social austerity suck pretty bad. There should probably be living wage jobs, affordable housing and a housing first policy for homeless people.
    May 27 12
    • Oracle pzd
      Wtf is a living wage job? A job is a contract between two parties, where one agrees to provide service to the other in exchange for an amount agreeable to both. We are not in the age of slavery anymore.
      May 27
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      Sure, Utah Republicans reduced homelessness by over 90% by implementing a social democratic-like housing first policy which created sub market rate housing. When they ended the program to take advantage of rising house prices, homelessness returned.

      Housing would take care of most public crapping by homeless. (I guess cops could still be used to patrol downtown to prevent pooping and peeing on the street by drunk yuppies.)

      Housing first would also mean addicts would at least have a private place to be - this would also make them less vulnerable to attacks from other homeless or angry yuppies and therefore reduce crime. (I guess I should have mentioned above that drug use should be decriminalized.)

      Since at least a third of homeless people developed substance abuse issues after becoming homeless, housing policies like this would reduce that. Since Job loss, bankruptcies, divorce and being kicked out by parents are more common than drug abuse as reasons for homelessness, living wage jobs would reduce that somewhat.
      May 27
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      “We spend more on social programs than almost anywhere else by dollars and %. Where's the austerity?”

      As percentage of GDP, the US isn’t even in the top 20 countries in public programs. It’s right below Japan and right above Mexico.

      It’s taken place over 40 years, starting with Jimmy Carter through Regan and Clinton, so you probably can’t “see it” like the proverbial frog in a boiling pot.

      Whenever US politicians talk about the deficit, they are really trying to make a case for austerity since both parties offer tax incentives and so on to business, the “balancing” really means moving priorities from programs and agencies to tax cuts.

      Further much of the spending is now indirect and goes to NGOs instead of directly to services. For example, federal money for homeless no longer needs to go to the homeless but is at state discretion.

      Here in SF “liberal” Gavin newsom ended cash assistance to the homeless and passed a sit-lay repression law. Nationally Bill Clinton “ended welfare as we know it” and dropped tons of people from the rolls.
      May 27
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      “Wtf is a living wage job? A job is a contract between two parties, where one agrees to provide service to the other in exchange for an amount agreeable to both. We are not in the age of slavery anymore.”

      Most Americans have less than 1k in savings and would not be able to pay rent or mortgage if they missed two paychecks. Yeah, it’s not chattel slavery, but those of us without trust funds don’t always have the luxury of unpaid internships, higher ed, or being picky about jobs... we have to pay rent and soon.

      A living wage job would at least be one where rent wouldn’t be more than a third of your paycheck. Average wages in SF are high at 8k month... average rent is 4.5k/month. I used to make about 3k per month working full time. I shared a converted prison cell-like laundry room for 3 years. If something unexpected had happened at that time, if I got a bad illness or something... might have been homeless for a time.
      May 27
    • @EllisDee25

      "It's right below Japan and right above Mexico"

      Source?
      May 27
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      www.google.com

      www.why-u-implying-i-lying.com

      https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Economy/Social-welfare-spending/%3E-%25-of-GDP/Excluding-education

      Or the original source for the last link here:

      https://data.oecd.org/socialexp/social-spending.htm

      The think tanks that talk about US spending use the same data, but that’s just using data as sleight of hand. Total spending is meaningless without comparing the size of the economy and other context. Percentage of GDP shows more about how wealth is prioritized... and for the US, social spending is lower on the list compared to other industrial countries.
      May 27
    • I'm not implying you're lying. Don't sperg. I'd never heard those stats.

      % of GDP is an odd metric because "austerity" usually refers to government spending while that captures it vs everything produced.

      What's the same comparison using % of govt spending?
      May 28
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      GDP tells us the size of the economy, roughly, so that comparison tells us how much a country spends on social programs vs the economic strength. Total spending itself would be useless since a populous country with low social spending still might spend a lot. You’d probably want to look at total spending per capita.

      The last link I posted has that info. There’s also google.com 😝
      May 28
    • Microsoft Hyad70
      OP
      Social spending may indeed be lower in the US, but remember, we bear the brunt of military spending that other developed countries have not been bellying up...Japan. Germany, France, etc.
      May 28
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      Yes, I think that’s true - don’t think it’s the right priority though.
      May 28
  • Microsoft GqTJ43
    This is bullshit. Seattle is the same as it always has been. Moderate climates on the West Coast attract homelessness. Portland & LA have similar issues.

    The KOMO special was a piece of propaganda masquerading as journalism.

    If you don’t like Seattle. Please, leave.
    May 27 7
    • Amazon
      ps.ily

      Amazon

      PRE
      Google
      ps.ilymore
      Let’s not ignore the blatant enabling policies from SF/Seattle city councils that allow homelessness and drug addictions to thrive. If I camp outside someone’s home in Studio City (LA), I would be evicted in a matter of hours. Meanwhile there are people camping outside of neighborhoods in Ballard completely undisturbed.
      May 27
    • Microsoft Hyad70
      OP
      Portland and LA are both Uber liberal. We left 3 years ago - poor schools, drug addicts, shit in the streets, poor people sleeping in parks and sidewalks outweigh the natural beauty...besides, what you get for your housing dollars is ridiculous... crappy and small unless you make insane amounts of money.
      May 27
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      Edit: I completely misinterpreted GQ’s intent in posting the link.

      Yeah, ever been to LA’s skid row? It’s an abandoned warehouse district with no rich people. LAPD literally dump people from jail onto skid row. Ambulance services dump uninsured people there as well.

      They do the same here... move homeless from rich or gentrifying neighborhoods to low-income or out of the way ones. “Liberal” SF also buys homeless people one way out of town bus passes. None of this is effective nor are Republican “solutions” because homelessness is not a set number of people, it’s a social issue. So you can lock up homeless people, hide them in a ghetto like LA, let them stay in tents and provide some minor services, but the structure of US society will just continue to produce homeless... most homeless people already are only temporarily homeless... the problem is that the rate of falling into homelessness has outpaced people recovering from it.

      GQ is correct, homelessness is more common on the west coast altogether... including in the Republican-run areas of California. Both parties have more or less followed a similar policy trajectory. Democrats use some nice words though while Republicans tend to be rhetorically meaner.
      May 27
    • Microsoft TrumpWins
      @GqTJ43 is probably a transplant and/or actively campaigns for the city to downplay the homelessness and drug problems. I know various people who have lived in Seattle for 50+ years and say the city has become a major shithole and not what it once was.

      We can go outside and see the problem with our own eyes. You and the mayor will never be able to trick people while the evidence is so clearly on display.
      May 27
    • Microsoft GqTJ43
      Yeah, you’re wrong. Not a transplant. Homelessness has always been an issue.
      May 27
    • Amazon djxjsnjs
      @gq if you want Seattle to get worse. Please, leave.
      May 27
  • Google Mmkaay
    Shitatle compared to Bellevue is like a shit hole compared to a beautiful garden. Hope Bellevue keeps it clean
    May 27 0
  • Google s4B0dn
    It's not just that. Cities that are temperate year round are probably your best chance if you're homeless. Not to mention panhandlers can actually collect decent money at the right places.

    That said the housing and opioid crisis don't help.
    May 28 1
    • Microsoft GqTJ43
      Yep, and heroin has been an issue around here long before Oxy ever existed. The overcast sky’s can lead to seasonal effectiveness disorder, which also doesn’t help. And a culture where becoming homeless might be more socially accepted and you can find a sense of community in the camps.

      Kshama Sawant and other politicians are horribly misguided to solely scapegoat major corporations as the only factor to this crisis. Housing and inequality is just on piece of a very old pie.

      You should grab a beer at the Hooverville bar in SODO, it’s just one reference to Seattle’s long history of homelessness. Unfortunately context doesn’t matter when KOMO created their special.
      May 28
  • Microsoft GqTJ43
    Nope. My position wasn’t get homeless away from rich people. I guess that was yours.
    May 27 1
    • Credit Karma EllisDee25
      Yeah, I completely misunderstood your reason for posting the link and thought you meant the opposite. My mistake!
      May 27

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