Us is a third world of first world countries!

Capital One / Eng
chmod778

Capital One Eng

BIO
A code enthusiast, maintains a low key profile in general.
chmod778more
Oct 16, 2017 193 Comments

After visiting Europe and 🍁 I felt this way!

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TOP 193 Comments
  • Microsoft Soduebdbd
    No it’s not. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Us is way ahead of Europe. Us lags behind many countrues of Asia in ecommerce, fin tech and manufacturing.
    Oct 16, 2017 18
    • Veritas Jgdrhg
      The US healthcare system is not a free market system. It is also not a socialist system. It is a system of crony capitalism. This means that government is used to reduce and block competition and to preserve profits of existing industry players rather than to promote competition, innovation, lower cost, etc. Turning it all or more over to government is not an answer. Moving toward something closer to a free market system is best. Use HSA's for most non-urgent/non-catastrophic care. Throw in some subsidies for poorer folks. Then high risk pools or Medicare-like for catastrophic care and you may have a system that is better than Canada, Europe and the US.- or anywhere.
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Microsoft asg slut
      HSAs don't help when price gouging is the norm
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Veritas Jgdrhg
      Free market system = HSA + competition. Government also has to remove the systemic anti-competitive rules and regs. That is where the price gouging comes from.
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Oracle / Sales Strongbo17
      You guys obviously don’t understand the difference between socialist systems and third world country...there is no correlation between the two. The reason public transport is better elsewhere is because everyone I. The USA has a car and drives...I drove all over the UK, Ireland and Germany when I was there and it’s clear the money was just spent on the road infrastructure in the states that was spent on public transport over there because their highways and freeways were death traps. Also, just because we don’t have socialized healthcare (which I agree is probably better for everyone) our hospital and medical care is far beyond anything over there. If you have a job and good insurance here then you will be treated like a kind whereas in Ireland or the UK, everyone just gets treated as second class passengers. The divide on where this is better can be measured in $$$$
      Oct 17, 2017
    • New mfml
      @Soduebdbd US has the best Drs in the world? You're joking right?
      Ask any Dr how would they fix say your leg that has 3 or more fractures. (Spoiler they'd amputate)
      When a transplant Dr gives a pt compliment what awesome family he has because they got him fruit basket (grapes, plums etc) along with 2 2l bottles of regular soda while that same pt is there to have foot amputated due to diabetes, praise him for good bedside manners.
      Tell them that they can use laser to fix broken vein in the head that bled down spinal column and created hematoma size of 6yo head instead of drilling a hole in the skull.
      They don't have to cut one's leg from knee down to foot to harvest the vein for bypass surgery.
      Come from say Europe with diagnosis and US Dr will not be able to read it because it's written in Latin.

      I can go on and on.

      Are there some great Drs here? Sure there are. But what I told you above is the norm, not the exception.
      Oct 17, 2017
  • Microsoft hrtN12
    then go live there if you dont like the US
    Oct 16, 2017 8
    • F5 Networks / Sales
      RedSpectre

      F5 Networks Sales

      BIO
      A spectre is haunting Blind
      RedSpectremore
      Ooooooooo sick burn, I’m gonna need some aloe for that one 😂
      Oct 16, 2017
    • BlackBerry AdultDC🐉
      @RedSpectre: He is an aggressive moron
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Capital One / Eng
      chmod778

      Capital One Eng

      BIO
      A code enthusiast, maintains a low key profile in general.
      chmod778more
      OP
      Is Microsoft a tech company? 🤔
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Qualtrics PCMan
      Holy shit hrtn how did you land a job at MSFT
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Oracle / Sales Strongbo17
      He’s a janitor he just has a Microsoft email so he gets notices to clean up conference rooms
      Oct 17, 2017
  • IEEE / Eng uhu
    Yes. Go to Europe. Find out how it is to live with an average salary, even with all the nice perks there. Most likely, in a brain dead job with decrepit managers. Engineer in Europe? Never again, thank you (unless it’s Switzerland).
    Oct 16, 2017 11
    • IEEE / Eng uhu
      @Blackberry, more likes doesn’t mean you are less wrong.
      Oct 21, 2017
    • BlackBerry JrmyCorbyn
      I know @uhu. It means @AdultDC is more right! Took you a while to find your tongue 👅. Btw it’s now 16 to 2 😆
      Oct 21, 2017
    • IEEE / Eng uhu
      @JrmyCorbyn you are an idiot just like your namesake. But then, if you are working at Blackberry in 2017, it makes sense.
      Oct 22, 2017
    • BlackBerry JrmyCorbyn
      You are a loser @uhu. Trying to flame me over Corbyn eh? Ask May how much her butt hurt when his party gained the most in the early elections at her party’s expenses
      Oct 23, 2017
    • Tableau / Eng
      SloppyJoe

      Tableau Eng

      PRE
      Microsoft
      SloppyJoemore
      Switzerland is a great country 😀
      Jan 14, 2018
  • Microsoft CountryMac
    Europe is a socialist shithole
    Oct 16, 2017 4
    • F5 Networks / Sales
      RedSpectre

      F5 Networks Sales

      BIO
      A spectre is haunting Blind
      RedSpectremore
      😂😂😂
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Google / Ops knVP54
      Says a guy/gal that probably never left his country...
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Oracle / Sales Strongbo17
      That’s a pretty general statement
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Go fix windows 10 multi GPU support if you're not going to leave the US though. Could really use that working. Anything above 6gpus bsod after build 1607. Thaaanks....
      Oct 22, 2017
  • Microsoft Soduebdbd
    Think about Europe - all Europe can do is make brands. Is there any tech or manufacturing innovation in Europe? They can sell high end luxury items and that’s all they can do. That’s it. You don’t understand macro economics. Europe, sans Germany, is a dead economy. Why do you think
    So many Europeans go to Asia. Their home countries have diminishing and contracting economies.

    In this life there are two countries that matter - US and China. That’s it. No other country matters or is consequential.
    Oct 16, 2017 11
    • Microsoft UltraTroll
      That's a huge list from a place with 800m people
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Microsoft Soduebdbd
      Hahahah - so cute - Those are all small tiny fucking companies or they got acquired. Big companies are 10 B plus. How many of those are 10 ? 10 B is a rounding error for ali baba or google.

      Bike startups in China are valued higher than all of these companies.

      Do you think the president of the Us would ever meet the founder of one of those companies.

      Fuck man. Grow up. 25B or more is relevant.
      Oct 18, 2017
    • LinkedIn / Eng Gill Bates
      Your question was "is there any tech or manufacturing innovation in Europe", not are there 10B plus companies in tech in Europe.

      Fuck man. Grow up. Learn how to internet.
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Microsoft Soduebdbd
      I have a side company that sells shit on amazon, doesn’t make me a tech company.
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Avanade libQ23
      Yes all of this definitely determines quality of life, and success of all individuals in a country.
      Oct 20, 2017
  • Zillow Group UsernameZ
    Visiting a country and living in a country is very different. I have lived in multiple countries that I later visited as a tourist and I can tell you the difference is huge.
    Oct 16, 2017 3
    • Nike / Eng MParker
      Triple
      Oct 18, 2017
    • LinkedIn Nailingit
      Voice of reason
      Oct 19, 2017
  • Twitter shdjskpqpn
    I felt the same after visiting China honestly
    Oct 16, 2017 5
    • Pinterest / Eng
      duisscheys

      Pinterest Eng

      PRE
      Amazon
      duisscheysmore
      Confirmed for only visiting the shiny tourist areas.
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Amazon httNwV6X
      Chinese love white people.
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Twitter shdjskpqpn
      The public transport infrastructure is pretty good in tier 3 cities as well.
      Ofc at the end of day 🇺🇸 >> rest of the world
      Oct 17, 2017
    • NASDAQ onceupon
      China does not qualify as being part of the civilized world, not yet at least.
      Oct 19, 2017
    • VMware /home
      @onceupon : civilized world. What a joke. Europe was a trash can just few decade ago. They decided to exploit resources all around the world and started wiping out native people everywhere. That’s what you see in USA as well. Bare any Americans left. All the whites here are Europeans.
      Nov 25, 2017
  • Google / Eng
    djeldl*#

    Google Eng

    PRE
    Uber, Microsoft
    djeldl*#more
    The U.S. is not aligned with any of the two dominant alliances of the day? #notwhatthirdworldmeans
    Oct 16, 2017 1
    • Nielsen / Eng zzzzzttttt
      You might want to check what third world means over the past thirty years, aspie.
      Oct 20, 2017
  • ExxonMobil / Eng ekabeht
    I have lived all over the globe (currently in UAE) and I’ll choose the US over anything else. Are we capitalists? Yes. Do we love money and value higher than other societies? Yes. Do we value less ‘time off’, etc? Yes. But, that’s who we are.

    Having a US culture I love the US. I love that people work hard, are efficient, and can critically think. I love how less in my face the government is.

    We aren’t 3rd world because we value things differently than Europe, that’s just your bias. We lead the world with innovative tech with Silicon Valley, we lead the world in Oil and Gas innovation in Texas, we lead the world in medical research (blah, blah - yes, I open a can of worms talking medically... but, I’ve been in clinics around the world, I’ll take my Houston Med Center and private insurance over all the foreign clinics).

    Love us, hate us - it’s been a capitalist culture in the US. But don’t try to mask a difference in opinion by a unfair comparison with aspects of the rest of the globe that we don’t even care about.
    Oct 16, 2017 1
    • Capital One / Eng
      chmod778

      Capital One Eng

      BIO
      A code enthusiast, maintains a low key profile in general.
      chmod778more
      OP
      Watch first episode of newsroom, It was an aaron sorkin series! But you can adopt the line of steve jobs with a twist, stay ignorant stay foolish!
      Oct 18, 2017
  • Microsoft Predisent
    Just move to Europe. No one’s stopping you.
    Oct 16, 2017 0
  • New / Eng MDOy74
    I've traveled extensively and lived overseas for several years. I've had friends on every continent but Antarctica. I really enjoy spending time in Europe and would love to live there for a few years, but I definitely disagree with this perception.

    Salaries in Europe are a fraction of salaries in the US. Good developers in Europe make between 40,000 - 70,000 Euros. Those same developers make low six figures in most of the US, and they make a quarter to half a million in certain parts of the country. Then you have taxes. Income taxes in Europe are nearly double the taxes in most of the US. Someone earning $100,000 here might pay $15-$20,000 in taxes, depending on their deductions. That's a 15 to 20% tax rate. The income tax rate in many parts of Europe, like Spain or Denmark, for people who make a decent income, is over 40%. So your net take-home there is about 1/4 of your net take-home here. There are a ton of other taxes in Europe, as well. Some European countries even tax your net wealth year after year.

    So is it worth it? Is the cost of living that much cheaper? Is everything simply provided by the government? Well, in the case of medical services, education, or retirement, yes, Much is provided by the government at no additional cost.

    What about the standard of living? Well, most people walk or take public transit. It's somewhat uncommon to own a car. If you prefer that lifestyle, then that may be a win. It's certainly more healthy than driving everywhere. But then again, you can find that same lifestyle in New York or several other US cities.

    What about housing? Well, if you live in the city, you're not going to find a lot of people who can afford an actual detached house. You'll be living in a flat with neighbors on all sides of you. For the same price that you'll pay for a two or three bedroom apartment in Europe, you could get a nice 3,000 square-foot house in much of the US.

    So perhaps it's just a question of preference. But that doesn't make one better than the other, not in an objective sense.

    So perhaps your real question is whether the quality of healthcare, education, and retirement is better in those countries. I believe the answer is no, but I'll save that for a separate post.

    Another difference is that our relatively low regulation has created a business friendly environment and a culture of innovation. Despite having many of our inventions manufactured in Asia, the US still leads the world in innovation.

    I haven't even touched on the difference in freedom. It's tangible. Try living there long term.
    Oct 17, 2017 2
    • Credit Karma Johmy
      Public transit, tiny flat and no detached house, expensive goods and services: you just described San Francisco, not Europe.

      Most major innovation in the US was done in government funded settings: universities or the military. Business innovation has mostly been finding ways to monetize these tech innovations.
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Microsoft UltraTroll
      Johmy, the government may invent GPS but they are not going to put it in your pocket
      Oct 17, 2017
  • Pactera / Sales excN16
    Agree. This is the most tolerant country in the world. The problem I believe is people have been sold on the antiquated notion of the American dream. Somewhere along the lines people forgot it involved enormous hard work as they’d have to do in their country of origin. They also forgot just like in their own country, you need to build something of value, hustle and be tenacious. There are no free lunches
    Oct 16, 2017 2
    • Amazon amzn12
      So a huge shift in wealth distribution and overall decrease in class mobility over the last couple decades aren't the problem... people are just lazy?
      Oct 17, 2017
    • Microsoft ill🥃2that
      @amzn12 He doesn't know what class mobility is
      Oct 19, 2017
  • MZ KvQn70
    I wish all these socialist idiots would all leave US and move to EU instead of whine here over their jealousy of successful people.
    Oct 21, 2017 8
    • MZ KvQn70
      They are more successful than average of course but they aren't members of the capitalist class.
      Oct 21, 2017
    • IEEE / Eng uhu
      Those socialist idiots are hypocrites too, otherwise they would be in the European paradise by now.
      Oct 21, 2017
    • CareerBuilder hdTI13
      Why would they be in Europe? There are no socialist countries in Europe. I'm quite successful by your standards and I advocate for many socialist policies. Perhaps you aren't as well informed as you think you are?
      Oct 22, 2017
    • MZ KvQn70
      Socialist policies like taking all your money, giving you tiny rations of chocolate, take away your freedom of speech, arrest you for not clapping loud enough at ceremonies of the great leader. Sound good to you, comrade?
      Oct 22, 2017
    • CareerBuilder hdTI13
      None of those are socialist policies...
      Oct 23, 2017
  • Microsoft UltraTroll
    Um no. Just look at the net influx from/to US and Canada/EU and you will get the truth
    Oct 16, 2017 0
  • IEEE / Eng uhu
    I’m an electrical engineer, worked for some of the major electronics and medical devices companies, in different countries. If you go to a hospital, you will probably be hooked up or scanned by some of the products.

    I only worked in North-Western Europe, which I’m told is the better place to work. So, working there sucks because:
    - It sucks because the management is filled up with idiots with economics degrees from second rate universities but zero technical competence.
    - It sucks because management is promoted by the management team based on having been members in the same student organization or coming from the same village - do look up “old-boy network”.
    - It sucks that said managers (a more apt term is damagers) do not understand introducing a new product, or innovation in general, they only understand cost cutting.
    - It sucks that new hires are underpaid even by local standards, and if opening the subject, you are flatly told that 10 other applicants are equally qualified and you were lucky to even get an offer and maybe they should rescind it.
    - It sucks that your performance has nothing to do with your pay.
    - It sucks making the same salary as a secretary or a driver, but far less than said damagers.
    - It sucks being the most competent in the room and get shot down with something like ‘the highest trees catch the most wind’, or ‘grass sticking out of the lawn gets cut’.
    - It sucks that engineers are the most uncool people even in an engineering company, not to mention outside.
    - It sucks being in a place where the foreigners are the lowest piece of shit.
    -It sucks seeing most employees happily filling in TPS reports the whole day.
    - etc, etc, etc.

    I was beginning to believe it was me. Hell no, I moved to the Bay Area, and now work with competent people, achieving far more with smaller budgets while being paid many times more.

    There is a reason the pay is many times higher here. That reason is not taxes, it’s the european aspiration to achieve mediocrity. And that is brilliant for at least 50% of the population. Just not for me.
    Oct 21, 2017 2
    • Amazon / Other
      ddate

      Amazon Other

      BIO
      all the messages posted here are a work of fiction and have nothing to do with the real life, used only for therapeutic interactions with imaginary chatbots
      ddatemore
      You just described a certain part of AWS ran by ex Microsofties.
      Oct 21, 2017
    • CareerBuilder hdTI13
      No, it was just you.
      Oct 22, 2017
  • Microsoft Soduebdbd
    OP - where in Europe are you referring to ?
    Oct 17, 2017 7
    • Google presumbit
      Yeah because we value individuals, their free time and families, a real work life balance for everyone. Do you know what we do on a Sunday? We go to the beach, to the mountains (hiking, skiing) or we just enjoy the time off wherever taking a tram, train and if we really have to a car. During the week, we enjoy (many times) commute times on average of 20 minutes. Please continue living in the US or wherever and perhaps buy our BMWs to do your daily hourly+ commute. Thanks
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Microsoft Soduebdbd
      And that’s why Europe is dying.
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Google presumbit
      Where do you see that it's dying? Our economy is doing really good actually. Dying because of some idiots in London you mean? Not our problem, Europe is not the UK
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Microsoft Woiduchdh
      Unemployment rates - 9.5 in France, 11.2 Italy, 17.6 in Spain, 9.5 in Portugal, 7.6% in Belgium. Greece 22.1. 57% of the French economy is public sector. Spain terrible credit rating. Greece is bankrupt. Italy’s banking is crippled with toxic debt. What else do you need.

      Germany is only country doing well.
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Amazon icehmla
      France is destined for doom. if people don't value hard working, they will be overrun by competition. this is a global economy, and lazy French people cannot win competition
      Oct 20, 2017
  • Citrix Systems / Eng kwik6
    America’s propaganda machine is second to none. We lag behind most “1st world countries” in most meaningful metrics. The people who are most gung-ho about America are the people who have travelled the least.
    Oct 16, 2017 4
    • Citrix Systems / Eng kwik6
      It applies to many Silicon Valley engineers. Just because someone is in tech does not mean they are clueless about non tech topics. I’ve worked with enough “Silicon Valley” engineers to know its endemic.
      Oct 16, 2017
    • IEEE / Eng uhu
      Being an engineer in most of Europe sucks. Yes, European poor or lazy have it much better than American ones. Statistics say something about the average people.
      However, smart engineers are much better off here. Back in most of Europe they are lucky to have shitty underpaid jobs.
      I strongly suggest you to live there for a while and explore the opportunities ;-)
      Oct 16, 2017
    • Synopsys rXYK57
      Uhu, what is it that sucks about engineer jobs in Europe and what kind of engineer are you?
      Oct 17, 2017
    • IEEE / Eng uhu
      Electrical engineer, worked for the major electronics and medical devices companies. If you go to a hospital, you will be hooked up or scanned by some of the products

      So:
      - It sucks because the management is filled up with idiots with economics degrees from second rate universities but zero technical competence.
      - It sucks because management is promoted by the management team based on having been members in the same university or coming from the same village - do look up “old-boy network”.
      - It sucks that said managers (a more apt term is damagers) do not understand introducing a new product, they only understand cost cutting.
      - It sucks that new hires are underpaid even by local standards, and if opening the subject, you are flatly told that 10 other applicants are equally qualified and you are lucky to even get an offer
      - It sucks that your performance has nothing to do with your pay
      - It sucks making the same salary as a secretary or a driver, but far less than said damagers
      - It sucks being the most competent in the room and get shot down with something like ‘the highest trees catch the most wind’, or ‘grass sticking out of the lawn gets cut’
      - It sucks that engineers are the most uncool people even in an engineering company, not to mention outside.
      - It sucks being in a place where the foreigners are the lowest piece of shit.
      - etc, etc, etc

      There is a reason the pay is many times higher here. That reason is not taxes, it’s the european aspiration to achieve mediocrity. And that is brilliant for at least 50% of the population. Just not for me.
      Oct 21, 2017
  • I've only been to America twice in the nineties and have lived in Europe all my life otherwise. I think the original statement is inaccurate. First, third-world? Not at all. I think it comes down to the following: If you have money in America, then it's awesome. This means having proper healthcare, a car (gas is cheap too), etc.. Europe is good if you don't make that much cash. The only thing that's third-world-like in America, are the cops.
    Oct 17, 2017 0
  • Aetna LIMA
    OP, don't buy all these comparisons using 'average' to other countries. You'll see that all these other countries do better on standardized tests and it's reported that the US is falling behind them. What they don't tell you is that in this great country we educate everyone. Everyone gets an education regardless of ability and everyone is tested and worked into the average. In countries like India, the lower performing kids drop out of school in pre-school. Our true average is compared to the average of their very best. No other country in the world offers as much opportunity to it's citizens as the US.
    Oct 17, 2017 2
    • Amazon / Eng 😀 smile
      Canada? The UK? Germany?
      Oct 18, 2017
    • Aetna LIMA
      I'm glad you brought that up and it is a perfect example. In 2000, Germany first let their students take standardized tests, the results were horrible. Much lower in every category than the US. Today, they top us. Why??? Because they send lots of kids to vocational schools that don't participate in the testing. In 2015, less than 30% of their kids completed a high school education that was intended to lead to college and those are the kids being tested. So their top 30% is being compared to the average of everyone on the US. Including those that would have been moved to vocational school in Germany. People that say that the US is lacking in education arent looking at the full picture.
      Oct 18, 2017
  • Europe is overrated as well as the US which is really good at selling itself. Lots of racism in Europe and after a while with few exceptions (cities) it gets all real boring. I'd go to live in Europe to retire though. Do you like your 6 figure tech salary? Only in the US you'll have it.
    Oct 17, 2017 2
    • Microsoft Predisent
      US people are equally racist. They might as well go back to Europe which is where our most racist immigrants came from.
      Oct 17, 2017

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