Why is blind against startups?

Palo Alto Networks / Eng BlueEyesCA
Sep 18 21 Comments

It seems tge majority of blind users are against startups.... Why? FANG TC trumps over a potential IPO all the time? I am genuinely curious.

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TOP 21 Comments
  • Oracle
    not_larry

    Oracle

    PRE
    Amazon
    not_larrymore
    FANG pays hard cash. Not dreams.
    Sep 18 2
    • New drypek
      The thing is, RSU is overtime (4y) so TC 350 can easily be AnnualTC 200

      You can have a lot better results in successful startup with a lot lower TC (including lower base)
      Sep 18
    • Oracle
      not_larry

      Oracle

      PRE
      Amazon
      not_larrymore
      Too bad we don’t know in advance which startups will be successful.
      Sep 18
  • Google entity 1
    youre naive... a startup can cash out for $100M and you can own %10 and you get $0 and it is perfectly legal. Early employees always get fucked, in one way or another. Look up liquidation prefs.
    Sep 18 2
    • Flowcast lulll
      Youre right big picture but your details are wrong. Liquid preferences only matter if sell price is below raised money + cash on hand.

      Down rounds do kill you and most companies wont sell for > 100M. Also for companies that do, only the founders will own 10% given all the dilution (30% per round)
      Sep 18
    • Google entity 1
      Depends on the type of liquidation prefs (for example 2x or higher, or participate liquidation prefs). Basically what I'm trying to say is:

      1. If the startup ends up doing amazing - then you would have only gotten 0.5% of something you worked so hard on, you should have just started it yourself to get 10-15%.

      2. If the startup doesnt do amazing - you get fucked, period.

      There is a fine line in which a startup does amazing AND you were early enough to make money AND you could not have started it yourself / something similar. This is an edge case at best, nonexistent at worst.
      Sep 18
  • New / Eng stoffel
    Because IPO’s being big pay days are rather like running the lottery. It’s not a robust strategy. Most small companies fail, after all. So in order to win big, you need to work for one that succeeds, and as yet I’m unaware of a reliable means of selecting that winning startup.
    Whereas with FANG, you have a consistency high TC, and if you are good at leetcode, a robust way of gaining access to these jobs.
    Sep 18 2
    • Palo Alto Networks / Eng BlueEyesCA
      OP
      But more chances to grow and learn in a startup than s big company. Founders with a track record help too. It’s a risk but the payoff can be a big one, no?
      Sep 18
    • New / Eng stoffel
      The payoff is a rare event, not the expected event. This kinda reminded me of a quaint firm started in the ‘90s by a pair of Nobel laureates. They had all the pedigree in the world, plenty of money, and yet still failed a few years later.

      But I think the risk-adjusted returns (as another poster said) don’t favor startups.

      As for learning, I can see the argument there. But there is still plenty one can learn in a large company too if you are looking for learning, so I don’t think that is a either-or proposition or anything.
      Sep 18
  • Facebook / Eng zuck 👑
    Risk adjusted return is significantly lower at a startup compared to FANG.
    Sep 18 0
  • Cruise Automation memepool
    Almost always. Fang pays too much for senior folks for the risk to be worth it. And once you make enough, makes more sense to join a syndicate or angel invest if you have connections than take risk on common stock.
    Sep 18 3
    • Palo Alto Networks / Eng BlueEyesCA
      OP
      My only interaction with FANG has been amazon. I wasn’t that impressed with the $ they offered...
      Sep 18
    • Amazon ajsgdk
      Amazon doesn't pay much in comparison with G/Fb/Apple/Netflix. They don't have refreshers at all and only compensate the top 5-10%, so don't count on Amazon for big money.
      Sep 18
    • Cruise Automation memepool
      TC is one factor, the other factor that I'm pointing out is percentage of TC that is equity, and the time value of that equity if liquid vs illiquid. Analyzing/modeling payouts for that equity is how I've personally decided what risk reward I'm willing to take with startup equity.
      Sep 19
  • Cisco 7oclock
    Startups, in aggregate, under pay and over work while providing shitty benefits and poor WLB. They largely exist to temporarily enrich the founders and line the pockets of VCs as most normal employees don't receive meaningful compensation in the form of options, so even if the company makes it big, mathematically you would have been better off at a bigcorp making a steady paycheck. Most individual startups will not check all these boxes but almost all will check some.

    It's like asking "why do people prefer playing poker to playing the slot machines. Don't you know slot machines have jackpots?"

    And they do, but you can't predict a jackpot, and while they do happen, they probably won't happen to you.
    Sep 18 0
  • Lemonaid Health / Data
    Teknos

    Lemonaid Health Data

    PRE
    StartUp Health
    Teknosmore
    Start ups are notorious for over promising and over working.

    It's a very cloak and dagger type of environment in my opinion.
    Sep 18 0
  • Apple vandope
    Unrelated but how do you like PAN?
    Always curious about that place and was considering applying for when i graduate
    Sep 18 1
    • Palo Alto Networks / Eng BlueEyesCA
      OP
      DM me.
      Sep 18
  • Microsoft / Eng
    leetcodexo

    Microsoft Eng

    BIO
    Senior Software Development Engineer
    leetcodexomore
    I'd rather LeetCode then waste my time on a take-home assignment.
    Sep 19 0
  • Low testosterone, risk adverse, no vision, small peepee
    Sep 18 0
  • Adobe mercury10
    I learned a ton in my early stage startup job but I burned out in a year and have shit to show for it monetarily. It sucks putting out fires all the time, death marching to an unreasonable deadline.

    Honestly, not the worst plan, but if you go the startup route step back after you start vesting options. Exercising and moving on if you believe in the co is not the worst plan imo.
    Sep 18 0