I was an Apple Engineering Manager in the IS&T division in Sunnyvale. Left after a couple years to go to a non-FAANG for a Sr. Engineering Manager role. Ask me anything. And I might as well get it out of the way: 15+ YOE Apple TC avg over 2 years (+refereshers, not counting stock appreciation): 303k New TC avg over 4 years (+anticipated refreshers, not counting stock appreciation): 491k
Fuck off
What inspired you about apple while working there and what didn't
Probably selling $1000 phones every 2 years. Very inspirational if you ask me.
Apple's got insane street-cred for putting out great product. I wanted to get into this and experience what "the best" was like. I learned craploads working here. I doubt I'll ever have a job tougher than what I had at Apple, and I'm grateful for that confidence it's brought me. What didn't inspire me is that the way Apple puts out great product is through lots of debate/arguments/pressure. Everything is insanely cross-functional, so only the best/strongest ideas make it through, and only after a *TON* of back-and-forth. Take for instance - there is no "iphone team". There are teams that work on the phone hardware, firmware, OS, apps, sensors, camers, etc... None of these teams report to the same person (unless you go all the way up to Tim Cook). Because of this, lots of relationships & XF-wrangling has to happen to move anything forward. It was very tiring at times. About IS&T specifically, the least-inspiring aspect was that there are so many contractors in the division. Contractors aren't as accountable, nor are as strong as FTE's, and are always cycling in/out. Also, since we're not allowed to treat contractors the same as employees, we often didn't invite them to team meetings, events, celebrations, awards, nor were we able to give them any additional compensation if they did well. It was a forced dual-class structure that I didn't like. In addition, almost all of the contractors (and most FTE's) are H1B holders from India, so there is very little diversity. Since I'm not Indian, it was often difficult for me to feel included in discussions, jokes, communication style, etc... I did honestly try, and so did they, and made lots of good connections; but I'd often hear inside jokes, or comments/phrases in Hindi that I couldn't participate in. And when the entire group that's going to lunch (or having a discussion) is 100% Indian male, it was sometimes intimidating to join in. I'm sure none of it was intentional, but it's pretty hard to not notice.
Congratulations! Which team in IST were you in?
Internet Services & Technology. I believe the division originally started as an IT org and over time expanded to own and run a number of services & responsibilities, such as iDMS, Gift Cards, Point of Sale, Infosec, etc...
I worked in the department that supported Retail in IS&T.
Have you spoken to Craig Federighi?
no.
Isn’t IS&T one of the worst grps at Apple?
IS&T is a 4,000 person division (not counting contractors, which is ~4,000 more people). Hard to put a blanket statement on something like that. Better/Worst is more applicable to actual teams. I think I actually had a pretty good team in IS&T. The team had very good WLB, people were friendly, and it was pretty chillax for most of the year, except for Summer, when it was time to prep and harden our systems for the new device introduction(s). IS&T also gets a pretty bad rep because a couple of disgrunted IS&T ex-employees wrote really popular Quora & Glassdoor reviews. Anecdotally, I've heard from peers about other teams that were way worse (Maps team, AMP team, Hardware, SEG). In general, though, unless you're Indian and/or were recently working as a contractor at a big firm (Infosys, Tata, etc...), I think most folks will fare better in a non-IS&T team. IS&T has *so* many consultants that are always leaving/joining so there's no staffing continuity. And there are many FTE hires from these consulting firms. Because of this, here's very little diversity in culture, background, communication styles, and gender. It can be pretty intimidating, especially coming from any other company which is more diverse.
Wife’s few friends were at IS&T and hated it. Ex wipro and Infosys people ruling the roost and treating people badly.
I'd wake up; since that's not reality.
Does IS&T pay so less to managers ? 3-4 yoe guys in Siri, AI/ML are easily touching 300k mark these days.
1. I was only at Apple for 2 years. 2. I didn't do well with negotiating my initial stock grant, probably because my base salary was so high (>190k). 3. My last review cycle short-changed me on RSU's. 4. I'm not counting stock appreciation or ESPP
IS&T managers just manage vendors and their offshore team and beat the crap out of them. There are not much FTE developers in IS&T and all the heavy lifting is done by vendors. Was that the case with you too?
@eBay - I can only speak for my department (Retail IS&T). The ratio of FTE to contractors (both onshore & offshore) is about 1 : 3. IS&T Engineering managers typically have 3-5 FTEs and dozens of contractors, reporting to either the manager or FTE's. A couple/few of those contractors will be local, with the rest in Austin or India. Almost all the FTEs are very strong engineers. The expectation is that if all of the contractors were to be dismissed, product development must still be able to continue. All of the design, architecture, and code approvals are done by FTEs only. To scale, they have all the contractors. As for the contractors, their quality is often (but not always) lacking, when compared to FTEs. They do a lot of the menial grunt work, and are often considered "second class engineers". I feel bad for them, often. This isn't an Apple thing - it's the same way most large tech companies in the Bay treat their contingent headcount.
how common is it at IS&T for contractors to be converted to full-time? Does it ever actually even happen?
Why such big jump in tc? Congrats! Yoe and experience?
Thanks! Updated post.
What is your back ground? Ml or backend?