Why does everyone say that MS lowballs an offer?

Microsoft / Eng
bl@nk

Go to company page Microsoft Eng

bl@nk
Jul 22, 2021 54 Comments

Microsoft offers espp upto 15% of your salary with a 10% discount on stock, 50% 401k matching upto 19.5k yearly from day one, equal division on joining stock bonus.

Good work life balance, stay fit program, great health insurance - customized option, if you stay in puget sound area.

Companies like amazon offer peanuts in other benefits namely, they divide stock unequally ( 1st year - 5%, 2nd year - 15%, 3rd and 4th year - 40% ) and 50% 401k matching is only up to 4% of base salary and they match after a year of employment.

Usually in msft it’s not just the base salary, other benefits are also considered as compensation. Why don’t everyone consider number of leaves, espp, 401k matching, stock division, good health insurance as benefits and only focus on TC? I maxed out 401k matching, espp and saved a good chunk.

If you plan on getting a loan for buying a house, you can also take one on top your 401k.

I personally used medical insurance a lot, since I had a great plan I paid very less.

Why do we have this obsession over TC? Is it lack of knowledge or would people rather pick higher TC and no benefits?

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TOP 54 Comments
  • Google
    jpmcbanker

    Go to company page Google

    PRE
    JPMorgan Chase & Co.
    jpmcbanker
    MS is a great company, it just low balls in comparison to top companies most of the time. Sure the benefits are solid, but many companies like Google, Facebook, Snap, Airbnb, LinkedIn have better benefits and 2-3x the TC in some cases, plus actual refreshers.

    MS quality of life is overall better than Amazon, but at mid/senior/principal Amazon tends to pay 100-400k more which greatly outweighs the benefits. Their vesting schedule is back-loaded, but their signing bonuses are huge and vest over the first two years to compensate. For reference, levels.fyi average Microsoft Sr offer is $214k, mid level at Amzn is $230k and Sr at Amazon is ~$330k. The $5-10k difference in 401k matching, ESPP, and Stayfit is negligible. Even health insurance wise, the difference is so huge you could go out and get your own private insurance and still come out ahead.

    I still love MS though and want to work there someday (have heard great things from peers). Undoubtedly the best WLB in industry though if you're on the right team.
    Jul 22, 2021 8
    • Amazon
      Muwp65

      Go to company page Amazon

      Muwp65
      > MS health care is way better than most others including G and FB … The impact of these benefits amplify as you get older. Yes when you are younger you could put a number like 20k to cap that. But it is valued much higher depending upon ones individual needs and situation.

      How does MS health insurance give more than 20k of benefit?

      I’ve always considered the health insurance at top companies basically equivalent. Add up the premiums and assume you meet the OOP maximum, and the difference is at most 5k for an individual and 10k for a family.
      Jul 23, 2021
    • Tableau / Eng
      ZeroKool2

      Go to company page Tableau Eng

      PRE
      Microsoft
      ZeroKool2
      Back in the days msft insurance was amazing and definitely superior. But after Obama's change I haven't seen it particularly better than Fb/G/Salesforce. Maybe it applies to very particular situations?
      I agree though on if you are a Principal that got a decent offer and a good wlb team you can have a great deal. I wouldn't call it the industry norm, but doable. The original post is still out of touch with reality though
      Jul 23, 2021
  • Oracle
    vWc3aj

    Go to company page Oracle

    vWc3aj
    Yes. It’s lack of knowledge. On your side though. You get 20k refresh and jump up and down. I got 400k this year and still not happy. I expected more.
    Jul 22, 2021 6
  • Try compare it to a non-frugal company? Not saying MS pay bad just that people often get better deals elsewhere
    Jul 22, 2021 3
  • Amazon
    yesnowfh

    Go to company page Amazon

    yesnowfh
    Since you compare Microsoft with Amazon, let me give you a more concrete example.

    My TC was less than $180k (from W-2) when I left Microsoft as L63 SDE. With all the benefits you mentioned, let’s assume the TC could be $250k.

    My average TC in Amazon in the past 4 years was $450k without counting stock appreciation (calculate the stock price at the time vested). As a TT year over year, my TC of this, next, and year 2023 will be ~$420k if Amazon doesn’t adjust the max TC for senior band.

    I worked equally hard in both companies, enjoying work more in Amazon because of larger scope and more impact, and more visibility.

    That’s why I am still in Amazon and have no plan to go back Microsoft.
    Jul 22, 2021 2
  • Netflix
    He$DeadJim

    Go to company page Netflix

    He$DeadJim
    Refreshers refreshers refreshers. Microsoft just fails here. Refreshers is what pushes TC, and keeps it above 400k in the Bay Area. Getting to 400k at Microsoft is a slow grind.
    Jul 22, 2021 2