Question for those who lost their Job at Microsoft in 2008 great recession

Cisco / Eng
O-Hai-Jony

Cisco Eng

BIO
hoe
O-Hai-Jonymore
Oct 5, 2019 223 Comments

Hello, I'm on the cusp of deciding which company I will work for. I am on the verge of deciding between: Military Engineering Job, A Firmware Engineering Job In France, and a Microsoft offer. I have been doing research into potentially deciding to Go back to Microsoft (I've worked there before) however I was in Highschool during the Great recession.

Can anyone give me a list of warnings and lessons learned that they wish the would have known before the Bubble burst in 2008? Should I go to Microsoft KNOWING that the Bubble is beginning to burst.

comments

Want to comment? LOG IN or SIGN UP
TOP 223 Comments
  • Oracle Sockets
    If you know when the bubble is going to burst you would not need to worry since you will make a killing on shorting stocks, no?
    Oct 5, 2019 19
    • Amazon / Eng AMZNBucks
      I was curious on the pay bands actually, especially for junior devs ~ 2 YOE. I withdrew from the onsite because I got pretty much a max offer for my level @ Amazon, and wanted to make the move to FANG, but really liked the company. (I was just burnt out from interviewing)

      Also are all the dev teams using rails?
      Oct 9, 2019
    • Upstart Lolmonies
      Not gonna get FANG money but pretty good considering a startup. Plus fwiw, options could be worth something. Most of the devs write in rails but there's some python. Also a react shop.
      Oct 9, 2019
  • Microsoft cptlsm
    Microsoft is probably the safest bet out there.
    Oct 5, 2019 13
    • GrubHub grubby
      Twitch, selling ads is not what an ad agency does 😂. And before you pull out vague theories about how demand for ads behaves during a recession, look at the revenue charts for Google for 2008 - and also how many people they laid off then.
      Oct 9, 2019
    • Twitch / Cust. Srv. dreamful
      Dude.... Google in 2008 was a small company that was literally distrusting a space.

      Look at Google today with 95 percent of its revenue coming from ads as one of the largest companies in the world by market cap

      It's 2 completely different cases. You're comparing apples to oranges if you want to see how Google did in 08. A better comparison would be to see what a top investment bank like Goldman performed during 08
      Oct 10, 2019
  • Uber
    budd

    Uber

    PRE
    Foursquare, Microsoft
    buddmore
    I worked at Microsoft in 2008.

    My thoughts:
    - FTEs (and CSGs) were mostly isolated from the economic downturn. Sure.... maybe base salary increases were lower... but there weren’t mass layoffs.
    - Applying for a job there was tough. I remember Waterloo students, for example, were lucky that their school had a special program that reserved internship spots for them. They were amongst the very few interns taken at that time.
    - Microsoft in 2008 isn’t Microsoft in 2019. Just because they didn’t let people go then doesn’t mean they won’t now. Perhaps they use the opportunity to clean house. Ya just don’t know.
    Oct 5, 2019 15
    • Microsoft goddamnit
      As I mentioned earlier, due to the downturn that started in 2008, Microsoft had 3 rounds of layoffs starting in May 2009, and at least the first two rounds hit engineering. I know people who were laid off in the first two rounds. The third round may have still hit engineering - I’m not sure, but AFAIK, my org was not hit in the 3rd round.
      Supposedly, we’d already cut “deep enough”.
      Oct 8, 2019
    • GitHub ™️gh
      > GitHub will definitely clean house

      Well, yeah but GitHub already aggressively fires people for no real reason so that's a given.
      Oct 8, 2019
  • Microsoft justanymph
    Knowing the bubble is beginning to burst? How do you know this? CNN?
    Oct 5, 2019 9
    • Cisco / Eng
      DennisNdry

      Cisco Eng

      BIO
      hoe
      DennisNdrymore
      All of the Bulls and Bears are showing. I like it. I'm just SPOOKED.
      Oct 10, 2019
    • Fitbit 0x56BD
      I’m neither, I just have been around long enough to know that fearmongering is just the standard now that we’ve been burned. Honestly it’s good and keeps most of us honest (except WeWork lool), but sometimes the news gets tiring. Google “tech bubble” and note a different analyst predicting a crash every year since 2009.
      Oct 10, 2019
  • New JxzE37
    I worked in Microsoft in 2009 and was able to chat with some fairly high up people and even with Bill playing a big role and wanting to not do any layoffs the board pushed for the layoffs. These days Satya and Amy have no qualms and infact there are mini layoffs every year in Microsoft nowadays that you don't hear about. I expect to see a reasonable number let go when a recession hits and as a new fairly junior hire your severance will be on the lower end.
    If you are impacted then it is better if it is sudden and quick. Otherwise the environment deteriorates if people know it is coming but takes a few months or more. In such an environment people turn on each and start fighting for the scraps. Maybe leadership even lets it fester intentionally so they can increase the 'voluntary' attrition and not pay severance. In this case even if your are spared the work environment will be very bad. If you anticipate a recession and are risk averse I would take the most stable offer like the military.
    Oct 5, 2019 12
    • New / Mgmt lHAU26
      There’s a lot to get to 124k as a GS. You don’t get to negotiate your grade or what step you are. It gets set and it will max out are 15 and if you don’t qualify for the next grade then too bad. But on the good side it’s a lot more stable and there is a lot going for it down the road. It is too bad they no longer have their pension and you have to stick with the TSP.
      Oct 10, 2019
    • Cisco / Eng
      DennisNdry

      Cisco Eng

      BIO
      hoe
      DennisNdrymore
      I'm being offered non competitive advancement which means automatic yearly pay increases until GS 13 step10. Jumping two pay bands since I'm an engineer. GS 14 and 15 are manager/director pay bands. With a wife, that's more than enough if she is working too... after that its marginal increases yearly with respect to the cost of living.
      Oct 12, 2019
  • Microsoft iamletired
    What bubble? Theres nothing remotely like the housing bubble going on now so comparisons to 2008 aren't going to be useful.
    Oct 7, 2019 8
    • Microsoft iamletired
      In 2007 most people were loudly talking about how it was a bubble but that they were smart enough to get out in time. They weren't.

      Agree you can't predict recessions. But OP isn't talking about a recession, they are talking about some sort of mega-bubble.
      Oct 8, 2019
    • Uber vquL67
      We might even be in a mega bubble. Or not
      Oct 8, 2019
  • Microsoft / Eng HINs46
    Stop worrying about such stupid questions and LC. If Microsoft ever lay you off, take severance get a new job.

    In other words, you earn a job, not beg for one.
    Oct 6, 2019 1
    • State Farm sweeeeee
      How much is severance usually?
      Oct 10, 2019
  • Oracle dnbhzc
    I was in the layoff at Microsoft in 2009 August. At that time I just joined Microsoft from college and had no idea which team was good and what to look out for. I had offers from multiple teams but choose a really bad team/group. Azure is big, but there will some teams that might be impacted, so make sure you pick a team that Microsoft really needs from business point of view.
    Oct 5, 2019 6
    • SAP / IT
      IKRJ67

      SAP IT

      PRE
      PayPal, Barclays Investment Bank, Chevron
      BIO
      Portfolio career person
      IKRJ67more
      Microsoft today is different from the one in 2009 — at least from the outside. Azure is a #2 player and seems unlikely that Microsoft is going to let that slide further.
      Oct 10, 2019
    • Zillow Group sofaking
      Also, Satya Nadella is a guy who knows what’s up. I would not take him lightly.
      Oct 11, 2019
  • Google fucklifeme
    Increase your work capacity, don’t worry about getting laid of, if you are competitive, you won’t be in the list, or if so, you will be able to find other jobs, I wouldn’t worry, and if it really happens, just go back home and play video games, take advantage of social security and don’t give a fuck, I don’t know why we need to live so intensively, just pick whatever work environment makes you happy
    Oct 7, 2019 5
    • Cisco / Eng
      DennisNdry

      Cisco Eng

      BIO
      hoe
      DennisNdrymore
      Hes on Amazon's new Poet team. Jeff Bezos is trying out something new this time.
      Oct 9, 2019
    • Amazon azbxcy
      Kindle poet and don’t know it.
      Oct 9, 2019
  • SAP / IT gtST12
    Similar opinion here, but I’m a bit more negative as I believe this coming recession is not comparable to 2008, it’s more likely the same level as 1929. The high salaries of software people since 2008 were largely based on the ridiculous QE from fed, as capital didn’t find anywhere else to dump their nearly free money, can’t imagine what might happen when the bubble bursts. Find a safe job? Ford’s car technician believed their job was super safe back in 1929 :(
    Oct 9, 2019 20
    • Cisco / Eng
      DennisNdry

      Cisco Eng

      BIO
      hoe
      DennisNdrymore
      I'll admit i could be wrong about the economy but I sure can make a damn effecient peice of firmware.
      Oct 10, 2019
    • Microsoft i84687
      If you would have researched the topic you would at least have a benefit of doubt. Blind faith in central banks is proof that you have either been brainwashed useful idiot (google the term) or you havent researched anything at all
      Oct 10, 2019

Salary
Comparison

    Real time salary information from verified employees