Let me start by saying I in NO way want to or intend to discuss the manifesto fiasco. But what I do find strange about the whole thing is how Google jumped to be a knight in shining armor to the sensitivity and well being of employees when, in my first hand experience, they have some of the most sub-human contracting practices of any company I have ever worked or worked with. Google hires hundreds of intelligent and capable workers and throws them in the meat grinder at it's Datacenters. They use these contracted workers to bolster their minority and female diversity quotas rather than hire these people outright for their skills to begin with. You're expected to work your long hours to perfection while you watch full timers bullshit and play around, but if you do it, please see the door on your way out. You're not allowed in any way shape or form to express yourself in a way that doesn't line up exactly with what Google considers normal, or you'll be fired. Basically, the advice I received from a Googler was "Never openly talk about religion, politics, or social issues (unless Google openly supports it) if you do you'll get fired". Want to have an intelligent conversation on the lack of explanation from the origin of species on the origin of life, and why they aren't related topics? That guy was fired the next day. I saw a guy fired hours after someone asked him what a Mason was and why he was one. Fantastic work performance, people liked him, etc. Fired a few hours later after that Googler disappeared to a 1:1 with her manager. One of my favorite parts was "Don't be competitive, it will get you fired" but, here's this neat little app we made that lets everyone see how they are doing compared to everyone else and ranks them, oh and low performers are fired fast. Ever heard of right to work? Google loves that law. I've seen them string people along for years and never hire them even though they were fantastic workers who consistently outperformed full timers and we're at great fit socially and culturally. Meanwhile all you college fresh software engineers are making 150k+ in Mountain View while these guys were making 13 dollars an hour doing 12 hour days in 96 degree server rooms keeping search, borg, and youtube up. Full timers would go on all the company outings during the work day while the contractors would stay at work, then the Googlers would come back laughing and joking and take the rest of the day off to dick around. Yet that 1000 server backlog isn't going to fix itself, chop chop meat, would hate for you to not be able to pay your bills. Your managers would rarely talk to you and if they didn't like you give you shit assignments, which we're almost always a death trap. If you weren't on good projects or assignments you weren't likely going to be there much longer. Don't get me wrong, I really loved my time and experience there, but the more mature and seasoned I became as an engineer and professional, the more screwed up it seemed looking back. What was really amazing were the Googlers I worked with who generally seemed to have a disdain for the whole process and we're generally great people. I think people need to know that contractors are second class citizens at Google and used purely for the work full timers don't want to do. A lot of people full timing at the data center were rest and vesters while these people on near minimum wage were desperate for a more than a one week opportunity. (yes of the hundred or so I was hired with, some 50 were gone the first week). It reminded me of the beach scene in Saving Private Ryan but with hopes and dreams instead of lives.
We once had a project be cancelled at Google, and while HR spent a whole morning on a Q&A session with the full timers on the team, they somehow forgot to even inform the contractors in the team of the cancellation. You know, the only people in the whole situation who actually had reason to fear for their job. I had to get up and go talk to them myself. I wasn't even managing anyone. So fucked up. I completely agree with the 2nd class citizen sentiment.
The Google reps did not inform the contractors because they're not employees of Google. You need to understand "co-employment".. That is an issue the contractors brought upon themselves when they sued Microsoft back in the 90s. since that time employers must treat contractors differently because they do not work for the company and must be treated as such.
Yeah it's YOUR fault contractors in the 90s!
Were*
Lol dammit Winston. It's late here haha
TVC life is tough
Contractors rights is an issue that occasionally comes up... But basically, you tend to have none. I almost destroyed a company once for offending me that way (it was a smaller one - easier to maneuver management into a dangerous misstep) As for Google being moral. Few companies are coherently so. And the dude was fired for PR reasons.
I agree completely. I work 15+ hour days and get paid for 8. Taking a lunch is frowned upon as are vacations and time off. I got bitched at for calling in sick so I started showing up even when I was sick. So did the others on our team. We've gone through name calling, racist comments, and such disrespect. People tell me, why don't you quit? Why don't you go to HR? Easy to say when you have food on the table while I struggle to pay off my masters degree. And go to HR so they can show me the door? Not so simple. I put in 4 years at this company waiting to convert. I've thought about quitting and then I think about all the time I've invested to be a waste. And every morning I wake up thinking "One more day. One more day."
If you don't honestly think it's going to change... Time to go get another offer and then force Google's hand, one way or the other.
I'd prefer to switch teams but they don't make it easy for TVCs. Well, not for my role at least.
I get what you're saying, totally, and I don't think it's fair either. to play devil's advocate, though, the job market is the job market. if you don't like it, go get a better job. the tvcs we have are often far better off than at most other comparable roles/companies (find me a large corporation that provides its personal trainers and custodial staff with three meals a day)
On the other side, if we'd taken that route, there may not be many women in the job market. The original issue was that women should be treated fairly. And in general, everyone should be treated fairly... So push back against existing systems that are evolving past the point of sanity is worth doing.
you over estimate the value of junky mass produced food. Custodial staff at almost any other company would earn health care outside of Google/FB. A school Janitor is union for christ's sake.
I don't think you understand what a company is and what "work" means. This isn't college.
We all also shape the world around us. It's not good to choose to be sheep... Although the dude took an extreme risk going against the company line and got spanked hard. Although it's because it's not just the company. Google is a very PC place. It takes almost no stances that aren't stereotypically liberal. The kid went up against the cultural narrative, and the mindless mob responded.
If you walk in the street with a sign that says "black people are taller on average and should use different restrooms" you're gonna get smacked.
This is what Amazon does in their warehouses too - I guess the boss folk must be eating the same food. You will read even more bleak stories here from first hand accounts from Amazonians :https://sites.google.com/site/thefaceofamazon/ I personally know 5-6 of these posters
Wow. Good for you guys. Why not simply unionize? There's no shortage of reasons. I realize this will jack up Amazon prime price but people are the ones who make prime work in the first place.
Unionizing will lead to more contractors like the OP stated. In theory companies like Amazon retail can be pretty much by contractors. I think there is no way a union could balance the needs of the variety of jobs that Amazon has. It would need 6-7 unions based on class of work - blue / white / grey/ whatever collar .
At will employment mother fucka 👍
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You must think the worst in humanity. That is a toxic sentiment that will stain your soul. Have you sought to understand the world outlook and acculturation of the foe you harbor? You might see your own vitriol in them staring back at you.
They aren't my foe, but I get your point. If anything even after years being gone I still strive for the company to be better because I've always believed in what they do. Apologies, I get a little passionate, you're right, very toxic sentiment, but it doesn't change that the environment itself is toxic.
You're bitter that an entry level opportunity at one of the top companies on the planet did not turn into a career. It is a tough lesson discovering your limitations. You find a temporal gap in their success to remind yourself of the wall you are angry at. You cannot see beyond the tachyons fading away at the future of your lack of accomplishment. You're guessing at what it might be. Time is now. If you do not fill your brain up with knowledge, forgive yourself, and stretch your limitations then you will not be happy. Get off the fucking internet.