At least for mid/entry level positions, I get this impression from reading stuff online and talking to engineers that worked there. Has MS or Amazon tried anything to be more competitive with companies like FB or Google?
Microsoft can be an exhausting place for some people, depending on what org you're in. Not because there is too much work to do, we as software engineers crave just that. But the work that a lot of people do can tend to feel so overrun with beaurocratic process that making a meaningful contribution feels laborious. Code reviews not being done because your manager is in 6 meetings a day and literally turns you away when you're trying to involve him and comes back about it whenever you're focused on something else because he couldn't keep up before but now there's suddenly a deadline. Couple that with a really subpar codebase from however long ago depending on some proprietary internal nonsense libraries and people who leave projects in shambles just to be promoted, the freedom and intellectual challenges of younger and more focused organizations becomes a sexy cozy feeling that you so desperately want. It's not the benefits, they're actually great compared to some others. But the feeling of being in a drop in the ocean is what makes me want to get out of my particular group. I've only been at MSFT for about 1.25 years after 5 years in 2 other companies.
Include Google in that list as well. I know many Google employees wanting to leave
May be the number of employees in these two companies is more than Google and Facebook.. and that's why you noticed more people from Amazon and Microsoft.🤔
My physician told me a story the other day about how tech workers are more burned out than doctors. The story goes like this: An Amazon tech comes into the Doctors office complaining that he’s burned out and depressed. He says To the doctor “I have so much work to do that I just can’t keep up! I swear I have the workload of three people!!!” The next day a Microsoft tech came into the doctors office and said “I am really depressed and frustrated. Every project I am assigned to has at least three developers working on the same task.” The doctor asked “why are so many developers assigned to the same exact task?” The Microsoft tech replied, “one guy does all the work, and the other two guys criticize him. “
MSFT and AMZN really are two opposite sides of the same coin. Feast (and eat so much that you puke) or Famine (intellectual starvation due to spending more mental energy navigating the abyss of PM's and DL's).
Great joke for a bar
As an engg mgr, my life is made hell by PMs that talk over me constantly in an attempt to prove they are being useful. I have tons of partners and super legacy code that was adapted to the cloud in a shitty way and we are, and will, be paying the cost of that for many years to come. Its an exhausting job and work life balance sucks. I have been treated for insomnia, anxiety and mild depression. I have insured myself for 2M just in case because i fear for the worst outcome. Learning to become frugal so i can quit this shitshow soon. Likely move into IC role, prep for interviews (very rusty there) and gtfo of here.
Please understand that everyone who expected their satisfaction to come from their job died sad and alone. Quit worrying about it or expecting it to be better in one place or another. Everyone here is in the 1% so now that you've made it what are you going to do with it?
Everyone here is in top 10%. And even that is being generous. We are far from top 1%.
http://www.globalrichlist.com/ Get some perspective.
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Do you really think Amazon is that bad
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I think the status quo has worked well for all companies involved so there’s no real push to change culture in any.
Correct. They don't believe anything is wrong, so they don't really try anything new.
And if speak out, you should be ready to walk out the door.