help me decide between two offers

T-Mobile / Data
xyzzzzzz

T-Mobile Data

PRE
Deloitte, Accenture
xyzzzzzzmore
Nov 26, 2019 133 Comments

Help me decide between these two offers in Seattle. Do these offeres looks good or I have room for negotiation.

Amazon Sr Data engineer

150k base/ 70k 1st year, 60k 2nd year, 120k stocks

Expedia Sr Data engineer

170k base/ 40k bonus split equally in two years/ 40k rsu equally vested in 4 years/ 17.5% bonus targetted year end plus better wlb

Current TC: 165k

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TOP 133 Comments
  • Amazon vt905
    I’d go to Expedia.
    Nov 26, 2019 0
  • New h0r4y
    Pick Expedia. Avoid Amazon like the plague.
    Nov 27, 2019 0
  • Amazon / Eng
    PCYz54

    Amazon Eng

    PRE
    Activision Blizzard
    PCYz54more
    What tech stack does Expedia data team work with? If you want to do big data tech, go for Expedia. I joined Amazon and took a bit of a step back with regard to tech being used in Data Eng org.
    Nov 29, 2019 14
    • Amazon iA71wc
      Curious to know what Expedia uses too. And I share the same sentiment as others here about DE in Amazon. So much of it is ETL and DBA type work, and not as much SDE type work like where I came from. It sucks that it’s really SDE’s doing a lot of ‘real’ data engineering.

      While there are some positives to my experience here they’ve mostly been soft skill related. Namely: learning to prioritize, experiencing real burnout and NEVER wanting that again. I got really good at reading system tables and can optimize the shit out of a query. But I’ve written MAYBE a few thousand lines of Python, and that’s it. And it was all for automating the DBA/ETL type of work mentioned above. My technical skills have regressed
      Nov 30, 2019
    • T-Mobile / Data
      xyzzzzzz

      T-Mobile Data

      PRE
      Deloitte, Accenture
      xyzzzzzzmore
      OP
      Expedia tech stack is fully on AWS, python, spark ,streaming , sql, micro service etc. Expedia doesn’t differentiate between DE and SWE roles.
      Dec 1, 2019
    • Amazon
      pudfhcf

      Amazon

      PRE
      Amazon
      pudfhcfmore
      Irony is : being at Amazon I don't use AWS and some of the other technologies that you have listed above as much as other companies do..
      Dec 1, 2019
    • Amazon
      pudfhcf

      Amazon

      PRE
      Amazon
      pudfhcfmore
      We use lot of internal tooling bs and adding to it the dev tools at Amazon are so complicated that it becomes difficult to experiment coding and packaging things.. Any suggestions from DEs at Amazon on how they learnt using the builder tools ?
      Dec 1, 2019
    • Amazon iA71wc
      It’s hard because as a DE, you’re usually closer to the business than devs. So it’s hard to ask.

      You have to go to builder hub, scour that whole thing, search and ask questions on our internal stack overflow. It isn’t easy, and everything is either throttled for pure AWS or has some arbitrary hoop to jump through that just overcomplicates things. I actually fucking hate how much things are duct taped and deprecated around here
      Dec 1, 2019
  • Expedia Group hell-world
    I believe it’s Amazon L6. I didn’t know the offer would be so low for Sr. Data Engineer. Def. Expedia if TC is the same. WLB is much better at Expedia.
    Nov 26, 2019 10
    • Microsoft fgajkie
      I know it has senior in the title but it’s still L5. I am at Amazon. Will send a screenshot from phonetool in sometime.

      This applies only to data engineer though
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon chamoy
      I'm an L5 data engineer at Amazon. My title is "data engineer II". Sr data engineer is L6/data engineer III. I've seen what you're talking about where someone has a better job title than their actual level. Seems rare IME.
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon Dr. Savage
      This looks like L6 middle of band for Seattle
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon
      iehebbak

      Amazon

      PRE
      Amazon
      iehebbakmore
      Microsoft-fgajkie - why the f do you need to share a screenshot of phone tool on blind?? Just answer the guy what you know. There is no no need to share internal tool details on blind
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon
      iehebbak

      Amazon

      PRE
      Amazon
      iehebbakmore
      Btw, Senior data engineer is L6 DE.. unfortunately the pay is not great as SDE pay and
      Nov 29, 2019
  • Salesforce TDLg18
    Amazon is a horrible, horrible company to work for. You will absolutely be treated like crap, guaranteed. My best experience at Amazon was the day I quit.
    Nov 29, 2019 6
    • Workday
      MXQM42

      Workday

      PRE
      Symantec, Workday
      BIO
      Amazon
      MXQM42more
      Can you go into specifics? What was it that made you feel treated like crap? What would you change? Was there anything good?
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Amazon Bromuch?
      Ya, I was asked by my team and boss to throw together an arch design for a qa automation platform because no one else on my team had experience (Im an sde). Anyway, when the designs were done 2 sprints later because of back and forth which was me educating people about selenium and BDD, I gave a sprint demo on what the platform was capable of.

      Later that week, a manager from a different team chewed up my manager in a staff meeting about the time we spent researching a good qa platform in which my manager threw me to the wolves and canceled the whole project.

      After that, I was doing fine and delivering on all my comittments so no talk of issues during my 1:1. Then I go on call to cover not only my teams issues, but this other team which niether myself nor anyone else on my team had experience with. There ends up being a sev1 outtage which didnt seem to effect us, so they wanted to know why. They told me that the customers I were serving were more important so I continued with those tasks. Then in the last hour I was asked to drop everything and do the report. Next day I was told I was being thrown on the devlist which precludes being pip'd which came out of nowhere.

      They didnt like how I handeled ambiguity with the report and the QA platform. Ill own up to it if I screwed up, but the problem was they couldnt give me anything specific when I asked.

      Anyway, I later heard they didnt believe sde's should be involved in automation and which is what they were upset with me about, and today it takes a week to process a customer because of how that team designed the systems. Im frankly blown away at how bad the engineering is for the project that Im on and how manual everything is. All of the outtages are self inflicted imo which makes the oncall a nightmare.

      Personally all the LPs totally resonate with me and everyone else at amazon,... the problem is that the actions of the managers indicate a different story and that we completely dont give a crap about any of them. From finance to Amazon, Amazon quality of engineering is garbage for my project... though it sounds like it totally depends on team/ org. Lmk if that helps, cheers.
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Amazon iA71wc
      “... didnt believe SDE’s should be involved in automation ...”

      That’s some unreal shit, lmao. How recent was this sev-1? I want to look this shit up so I can avoid this radioactive org
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Amazon Bromuch?
      This was the IAD6 data center outtage 2 or so weeks ago. Im on a horizontal devices team :/
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Salesforce TDLg18
      The list is large and I don't want to dwell on it because I've moved on now but I was lied to from all levels of management on a regular basis - for example I discovered that several people at a lower grade than me (including a new grad) were getting paid on average 50% more than me. When I brought this up my manager flat-out lied to my face and told me it wasn't true (I know for a fact it was true, the people involved specifically disclosed their salaries to me). Before this I had years of good performance reviews and despite this was given below cost-of-living pay increases (which effectively amounts to a pay cut) with the excuse of "budget considerations". I had a manager who was desperate to get ahead and make a name for himself and stole ideas I had floated in meetings and presented them as his own. When I called him out on this he accused me of not being a team player. Was even kept waiting over an hour for my exit interview after I handed my notice in which just made me laugh. Trust me, Amazon has no respect for their engineers.
      Nov 30, 2019
  • Tableau / Eng
    Kciwi93

    Tableau Eng

    PRE
    Microsoft
    Kciwi93more
    Anecdotally most people don't last long enough at Amazon to see all that money
    Nov 29, 2019 1
    • Amazon readme.q
      But they see the cash in the first two years
      Nov 29, 2019
  • This comment was deleted by original commenter.

    • T-Mobile / Data
      xyzzzzzz

      T-Mobile Data

      PRE
      Deloitte, Accenture
      xyzzzzzzmore
      OP
      At this point if I am making same amount of money I’d better stick with better WLB . Also the tech stack and career growth opportunities look better at Expedia at least the group I interviewed with. At amazon I’ll be stuck at L6 level for few more years with little to no change in compensation ( that’s what I’ve heard from several people)
      Nov 26, 2019
    • T-Mobile / Data
      xyzzzzzz

      T-Mobile Data

      PRE
      Deloitte, Accenture
      xyzzzzzzmore
      OP
      Thank you for confirming !
      Nov 26, 2019
  • Amazon / IT
    zjXV38

    Amazon IT

    PRE
    Flipkart, Amazon
    zjXV38more
    That's too low for an L6 at Amazon. L5 makes more than this. And once your in Amazon, forget about the growth.
    Try to negotiate with Amazon, otherwise join Expedia. WLB is much better at Expedia.
    Nov 26, 2019 3
    • T-Mobile / Data
      xyzzzzzz

      T-Mobile Data

      PRE
      Deloitte, Accenture
      xyzzzzzzmore
      OP
      What would be ideal offer for L6 data engineer at amazon. I keep hearing every role has different band for L6
      Nov 27, 2019
    • Amazon 🙈TC
      L5 for this job does not make more than this. You are likely comparing a completely different job function.
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon AMZL11
      For sure L5 DE won’t make this much, this is definitely L6 DE offer. I think if you choose Amazon you can negotiate more on stocks as your base and sign in bonus already looks good.
      Nov 29, 2019
  • Amazon / Eng no email
    Blind likes to circlejerk over how bad amazon is so don't expect any unbiased answers here.
    Nov 29, 2019 6
    • Databricks / Data
      data4u

      Databricks Data

      PRE
      500 Startups
      data4umore
      While you may have a good experience a overwhelming amount of people have had shitty experience. So if you have an offer from Amazon the odds of being on a shitty team are much higher then a good one, it’s something to seriously consider.
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Salesforce / Eng
      sparticus

      Salesforce Eng

      PRE
      Amazon, Apptentive, HERE
      sparticusmore
      I was there for 6 years. Old line departments had good support and relatively realistic expectations. I was happiest in those groups. New lines did not have any support groups and had entirely unrealistic, unsustainable expectations. I had the worst experience of my career in over of them.
      The stock games they played applied across all groups.
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon / Eng no email
      Just due to sheer number of employees, and the fact that people tend not to post neutral or positive experiences will skew the data heavily towards the negative compared to smaller companies like Expedia.

      I'm not saying I know or really care either way, I'm just saying that the answer you're OBVIOUSLY going to get from posts like this is that amazon sucks and you should pick the other company.
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Google b6e
      Is there a different forum where people are rah-rah about Amazon?
      Nov 29, 2019
    • Amazon iA71wc
      Yes! Internal Amazon channel on Blind.

      Just kidding, most of it is PIP/dev list related and the same 3-4 orgs and directors being called out for the worst WLB and managers in all the west coast
      Nov 30, 2019
  • Expedia Group Techie17
    Expedia has better WLB and career growth so I would suggest Expedia based on the salary you posted. I would go for Amazon if they offer significant increase in salary.
    Nov 26, 2019 5
    • T-Mobile / Data
      xyzzzzzz

      T-Mobile Data

      PRE
      Deloitte, Accenture
      xyzzzzzzmore
      OP
      That’s what I was thinking significant increase would be at least 20k more
      Nov 26, 2019
    • Microsoft gYVH75
      More like 50k more than what they are currently offering
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Amazon toreador
      No offense, but Expedia is a company in decline. Betting your career on it is for hopes of “better WOB” is dubious to say the least. Besides, WLB is always very team specific, especially in Amazon.
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Microsoft gYVH75
      Considering a vast majority of employees leave/burn out/get fired within 2 years, I don’t think it makes sense to work at Amazon at this sort of TC. You are better off spending this time growing skills/experience to become a better engineer than slave away for one of the most hostile and predatory companies on this planet.
      Nov 30, 2019
    • Amazon Peppi
      Toreador, I wonder why the best Microsoft engineers keep coming to Amazon then !
      Dec 2, 2019

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