Isn’t it dumb of county to fine in below scenario?
First check the image below. In Washington, at red light signal, free-right turn scenario. While taking free right on red light, one need to yield to nobody in below scenario. It is impossible to have any traffic from left or movement of any pedestrian on right. Isn’t it a common sense that it’s is 100% safe to not stop. Just yield is enough to ensure traffic safety here. Law was made to cover for all edge cases, but they should not fine us for this case when there actually was no need to stop at all technically. PS: We should always do full stop in all other cases when we have to check for pedestrians or incoming traffic or yield to either.###
Pedantically, law for this case should be limiting the speed to under 5, 10 or 20mph. Should not be complete stop and look for pedestrians and yield and all.
It's called erring on the side of caution. It's simple enough to follow and good for everyone, so just do it? Other option is to scrap right turn on red completely.
Yes it can be a law. Easy to remember and communicate. But I think one should not be fined in this specific scenario. Agree?
The person turning right needs to yield to U-Turns being made at the left green arrow. There is already an explicit mechanism for indicating a no-yield protected right turn: green right turn arrow. Most intersections in Washington and elsewhere will have a green right turn arrow if U-Turns are prohibited and their is no need to stop or yield for pedestrians.
Nice. But this only requires yield. Why should one do full stop when it doesn’t serve any purpose.
You are entitled to your opinion, but you are wrong. It’s pretty clearly called out in the law: “Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall remain stopped to allow other vehicles lawfully within or approaching the intersection control area to complete their movements. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall also remain stopped for pedestrians who or personal delivery devices that are lawfully within the intersection control area as required by RCW 46.61.235(1)” 46.61.060 shall not enter the roadway. (3) Steady red indication (a) Vehicle operators facing a steady circular red signal alone shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection or, if none, then before entering the intersection control area and shall remain standing until an indication to proceed is shown. However, the vehicle operators facing a steady circular red signal may, after stopping proceed to make a right turn from a one-way or two-way street into a two-way street or into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the right turn; or a left turn from a one-way or two-way street into a one-way street carrying traffic in the direction of the left turn; unless a sign posted by competent authority prohibits such movement. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall remain stopped to allow other vehicles lawfully within or approaching the intersection control area to complete their movements. Vehicle operators planning to make such turns shall also remain stopped for pedestrians who or personal delivery devices that are lawfully within the intersection control area as required by RCW 46.61.235(1).
I am not saying law doesn’t state to stop today. I am exploring if law should change to yield (instead of complete stop) for free right turn during movement of incoming traffic. To favor the simplicity of law, let’s leave the law as it is. At the least judges and law enforcement folks should be informed to skip fines in those cases?
Many intersections have a right turn green arrow that comes on in this situation, because there's no need to stop. But that's only if the turning cars are with their own dedicated light. If the turning cars are turning because there was a gap in their oncoming traffic then you need to yield. The problem is that you cannot know which situation it is because their light is perpendicular to your line of sight. And so you must yield every time.
OP you broke the law by driving dangerously. Just own up to it and learn instead of spamming this all day.
To other examples mentioned here You don't know if those left turners turn bc they have green arrows or because they are clear for them (nobody to yield ). That means there could be pedestrians on your way. As well as ongoing traffic (since you just trusted left turners it's clear, which does not mean it is)
When there is a red light you must come to a complete stop before turning. If it was a yield, there would be a sign or flashing yellow light. It’s isn’t dumb to keep traffic control devices standardized.
I don't run into this issue because I don't own a car, I find the act of driving pretty barbaric. TC: $280k
If people don’t have to stop, they may go faster than they have to and hit traffic moving in the opposite direction while turning right. Besides, they will need to introduce new road marking, “stop line except when turning”. It complicates things, and every complication lead to more accidents.