Conservative Logic

Microsoft 🦍Ape
May 17 97 Comments

Banning guns will not stop people from getting guns!

Let’s ban abortion!

Takeaway here is offering abortions is the humane thing to do to stop people from stabbing themselves with coat hangers regardless of whether you think it’s right or wrong.

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TOP 97 Comments
  • Oath whoami@@
    Conservative and logic . That is funny.
    Majority of conservatives are Jesus loving, bible thumping guys who are not known for their rational thinking. They have hard time understanding climate change or evolution . Majority of them believes earth is 6 thousand years old.
    And few smart conservatives are too busy playing victim hood game and blaming media , Silicon Valley and Hollywood for all their problems.
    May 17 16
    • New / Eng TrhU36
      It was your quote, not mine... I bet you thought there was no way Trump could beat Hillary too. And I didn't vote for either by the way. You're the reason the Democrats lost. You dismissed the the other side vs the visceral "conservatives make no sense" I could say the same and that liberals are sheep and only respond in memes. I choose to listen.
      May 17
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Wat. I don't participate in the American political system 🤣 I just like laughing at it. Conservatives make no sense. I get it, conservatives won an election after losing a couple and are very proud of their achievement.
      May 17
    • New / Eng TrhU36
      As a study of the American political system, you must know that the presidency often swings to the other party after 2 terms. Last exception is Bush senior. When Obama was president, the people elected Republicans in both the house and Senate as a rejection of his policies. The house just went back to Democrat control after 8 years to reject Trump policies. Its fairly predictable.
      May 17
    • Google Mr. GIass
      It absolutely is predictable. Which is why it's hilarious when conservatives see the trump victory as some sort of achievement.
      May 17
    • Facebook / Other
      Janitorque

      Facebook Other

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      Janitorquemore
      Mr. Glass, which country are you originally from?
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Why do you want to know?
      May 18
    • Facebook / Other
      Janitorque

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      Janitorquemore
      My theory is that people from quite conservative countries and with personally conservative values become liberal in their politics when they come to the US. Wanted to see if that is the case here.
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Interesting theory.
      May 18
    • Facebook / Other
      Janitorque

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      Janitorquemore
      Does it check out in your case?
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      It doesn't.
      May 18
  • Google Mr. GIass
    Conservative positions are really random. It's hilarious and sad at the same time. I don't think the word 'conservative' really applies to the republicans anymore. They have mangled what it means to be conservative. The republicans of the past at least seemed like respectable individuals, albeit with strange viewpoints.
    May 17 22
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Sorry, I'm not buying that. Religious conservatives are railing against abortion largely because that is what they believe the Bible is espousing. The vast majority of the same don't apply the same biblical principles to the protection of innocent lives in classrooms because their love for guns is a higher priority. That is an inconsistency that they will always be pilloried for.
      May 17
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Winter is coming.
      May 17
    • IBM olkh
      Amazing that conservatives are against Muslims and sharia but then ban abortion statewide, then they cry and beg for limited government , but only where they see fit. Sounds like these people would love living in the middle east
      May 17
    • Microsoft BarFoo
      @thorsten55 I didn't say anything about school shootings. As I said earlier "Or like making sure that kids get guaranteed food. And healthcare. And that their parents aren’t forced to take 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet so they can actually have a strong family unit."

      So I'm trying to figure out at what point these kids lost their souls or their innocence such that "fuck you, your momma shouldn't have gotten pregnant if she couldn't take care of you!" is appropriate.
      May 17
    • Microsoft BarFoo
      Yes, because charity ensures that 1 out of 5 kids in America aren’t in poverty, unsure whether they’ll get proper clothes or food. Right.

      It’s a systemic problem brought on because the GOP doesn’t care. As long as they like their pockets, they give no shits. And they managed to tie religion to their platform, ensuring the poor and uneducated continue to elect them even though it’s not in their best interests.

      The GOP are a cancer on the people of the United States.
      May 18
    • IBM olkh
      Sperm has souls too, they are fucking alive, so stop jacking off you murderers
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      How dare you stop jacking off? Think off all the unborn kids you are holding in.
      May 18
    • IBM olkh
      Everytime you jack off you're killing thousands of children, also jacking off is not allowed in Christianity
      May 18
    • IBM olkh
      People start picking and choosing from the ancient text, follow the holy Bible just like Muslims follow the quran
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      You're right. Conservatives are fully supportive of jerking off.
      May 18
  • Oracle alwzangry
    Reading various opinions on this thread - it's like, let's take all the people who like blue color and label them as balloons, and say all balloons hate the yellow color.

    Sounded ridiculous?

    That's exactly how there's no sense in picking 15 different arguments from 15 different groups and attributing all of them to one single, arbitrarily defined group.

    Happy weekend, y'all!
    May 17 5
    • Google Mr. GIass
      While in theory you may have a point, in practice there are largely two groups who vote and think like respective monoliths. No point pretending like that's not the case.
      May 17
    • Oracle alwzangry
      You may vote for one side, but don't lump all arguments like they all agree. Just because of binary choice in election, the world doesn't become a black and white photograph with no shade of gray. Thinking that way is intellectual laziness.
      May 17
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Until I'm proved otherwise by intelligent individuals who aren't driven by the hive mind of their party, I will lump them by default. I've found it to be largely accurate save for a small percentage of individuals.
      May 18
    • Oracle alwzangry
      qed
      May 18
    • Google Mr. GIass
      You can 'qed' all you want. This country is driven by the hive minds of two parties. Until that changes, my approach to people obsessed with their parties won't change.
      May 18
  • As a non-native resident I often get confused by American sex culture. hookups are common among young people, yet abortion after 6 weeks is forbidden in many states.

    EDIT: abortion -> late abortion
    May 17 4
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      It isn’t forbidden anywhere in the US. The standard is viability.
      May 17
    • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
      It's so sad to scroll down and see this post from before three states banned it after six weeks...
      May 26
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      The bans are unconstitutional, judges are already blocking them.

      It was an unconstitutional attempt to score cheap points with an ignorant political base.
      May 26
    • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
      The fear is it'll make it all the way to the supreme court, which now has a conservative majority, so there's no telling what's gonna happen
      May 26
  • This comment was deleted by original commenter.

    • Facebook / Other
      Janitorque

      Facebook Other

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      Janitorquemore
      Chuckr, is that you?
      May 18
    • Facebook / Other
      Janitorque

      Facebook Other

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      Data scientist
      Janitorquemore
      Not a SWE, too much money for me
      May 18
  • Microsoft TrumpWins
    Some would say society is in a bad and bizarre place when it’s considered inhumane to reproduce. That’s literally the one objective reason people are on earth.
    May 17 5
    • Google Mr. GIass
      lol
      May 17
    • Microsoft TrumpWins
      You know it’s true. Some guy in another thread said he’d be fine to abort if his girl got pregnant because a pregnancy would mess up their careers. So what he’s saying is they put material gains over raising a family. Isn’t that a bit strange to you? It certainly wasn’t like that in past generations.
      May 17
    • Google Mr. GIass
      lol
      May 17
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      If child mortality rates exceed 50%, yes, it is inhumane to have children knowing that they will most likely die before reproducing.

      We are a social species, no one individual needs to reproduce.
      May 18
    • New / Eng |l|l||l|l|
      Nobody said it's inhumane to reproduce
      May 21
  • New / R&D
    wizzzz

    New R&D

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    wizzzzmore
    Abortion should be legal and rare and most people will be fine with it. Recent rise in the support for abortion bans is a reaction to the society using abortion too frequently, as contraceptive and trivializing it. This trivialization is what gets the conservatives going.

    Both the liberal and conservative extreme positions are unsatisfactory. We need reasonable limits on the right to choose abortion, so that people can't abuse it like they do now.

    There are responsibilities that go along with every right that a society is willing to grant to individuals.
    May 31 8
    • Google Mr. GIass
      This is incorrect. I remember coming across several different sources pointing to the US abortion rates declining. One said that 2018 had the lowest abortion rate in over a decade. Another pointed to 2015 as having the lowest rate in three decades. While it's unclear who has the most accurate numbers, abortion rates have certainly been going down. In fact, I've never come across a conservative who framed their argument the way you're positing they do. It seems like a made up argument to make their position sound more defensible. If the numbers backed up the made up argument, perhaps it would have more weight. So your assertion and defence of the conservative position is baffling. Maybe Fox News has alternative numbers?

      The conservative position, as I understand it is largely because they think the Bible tells them it's wrong. (It doesn't).
      May 31
    • New / R&D
      wizzzz

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      wizzzzmore
      > US abortion rates declining
      "little bit less of a bad thing" is not a good argument for someone who thinks it is bad and should be done way less often. It is like saying that opiate addition rates are declining. One can still argue that doctors should be prescribing that stuff way less often - like don't send me home with a bottle of vicodine after a tooth extraction.

      > The conservative position, as I understand it is largely because they think the Bible tells them it's wrong. (It doesn't).
      I have seen most conservatives use the "sanctity of human life" argument and I rarely hear religious arguments. Maybe it's a sampling bias on my part. Either way, unfortunately the progressive response to double down on the "clump of cells until viability" argument, which leads to a dead end in the conversation. The real answer is indeed somewhere in between the two extremes (life at conception vs life at viability), if there is an answer at all.

      It would probably be much better to say that -
      - we value human life and aren't sure when a fetus becomes "human"
      - we need the right to perform abortion
      - we are okay with reasonable restrictions that prevent us abusing the right
      May 31
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Point 1: I was correcting your lie. Nothing more, nothing less. You lied about the reason for the conservative position and needed to be educated.

      Point 2: Unless you can prove it is being abused, you're not going to get anywhere with progressives. Your argument appears to be that progressives actually enjoy
      abortions and like doing it all the time, which is a bizarre take. Nobody enjoys this, they're merely asking for the choice.
      May 31
    • New / R&D
      wizzzz 🧠

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      wizzzz 🧠more
      > You lied about the reason for the conservative position and needed to be educated.

      Get down from your high horse. Have some humility. You don't know everything.

      I said that the apparent abuse of abortion rights get the conservatives going, not that it is their only reason. I don't care about what people think, until they act.

      BTW, most religions of the world view abortions unfavorably. This is not a Christianity or American thing -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_and_abortion

      Religion is a big reason, but there are many non-religious reasons why people appose abortion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_aspects_of_the_abortion_debate.

      Only ~20% people in the US think that abortion should have no restrictions --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societal_attitudes_towards_abortion

      > prove it is being abused

      That is subjective, but data like this doesn't help -

      http://ahca.myflorida.com/MCHQ/Central_Services/Training_Support/docs/TrimesterByReason_2018.pdf

      large fraction of abortions are elective or due to social/economic reasons, not medically required or for extreme situations. This can be interpreted as abuse.
      Jun 1
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Of course I don't know everything. There is no high horse. I'm 'progressive' and have no problem admitting that the conservatives have a viewpoint that they are able to justify to themselves. But using lies to do so is something I will always call out. Your claim was that 'recent rise in the support for abortion bans is a reaction to the society using abortion too frequently'. This simply doesn't hold when abortion rates are declining. Based on your logic, support for abortion bans should have been a lot higher in the past.

      My argument included nothing about 'religions of the world' - merely that the Bible isn't really as pro-life as Christians want it to be. Or alternatively, Christians don't seem to know what's in the Bible themselves and perhaps are just parroting what the 'religions of the world' expect them to.

      I don't see how 'economic reasons' is tantamount to abuse. If you don't have the means to take care of a human, it makes little sense to me to subject that potential human to the world when you can't even take care of them. Or course, the conservatives want them to have 'right to life' but don't seem to care about the details of that potential life very much. But again, they are able to justify that stance to themselves because 'religion'.

      The way I see it, one side has a heavier reliance on reason, the other has a heavier reliance on what they think God wants.
      Jun 1
    • New / R&D
      wizzzz 🧠

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      wizzzz 🧠more
      Glad you presented logical arguments instead of calling me a liar.

      I am trying to understand why there is a such a large movement against abortion now. It seems like a backlash to something. That something seems to be the pent up frustration/anger about widespread use of abortion.

      The idea that people should not create a life just to snuff it out casually has merit from a humanist perspective. A woman's right to make the decision is also logical. To me, the only way to make both these arguments coherent is if women use their right judiciously, which means not using it as contraception.
      Jun 1
    • Google Mr. GIass
      There is a movement likely because the right feels like they can get more 'pro-life' legislation passed since trump put two conservative judges on the Supreme Court. Especially since conservative judges are more likely to back regressive laws.
      Jun 1
    • Google Mr. GIass
      Women using their right 'judiciously', while a noble thought isn't a strong enough argument to punish the entire female gender.

      Again, nobody enjoys getting abortions. It's bizarre that the right seem to think you can legislate morality. People will continue having sex, and continue getting pregnant with fetuses they aren't in a position to raise. The right is only making it more dangerous for women who choose to have sex. And it's clear they don't care about them. Hopefully this is just a regressive phase. Thankfully most other developed countries handle this issue more sensibly.
      Jun 1
  • Apple castigator
    What about “less government and more people freedom” and “let’s regulate women body to the detail”?
    May 18 5
    • Apple castigator
      Mmm, should then propose to remove the 2nd amendment then?
      May 18
    • Apple castigator
      Pro-life has everything to do with big government, don’t make wrong assumptions.

      First, they defined themselves when does life starts. Heartbeat but no brain activity. I would rather state the latter, but they push for the former. Second the decision to abort the fetus, not the baby, is a deeply personal one. I don’t want the government to govern my body.

      Regarding your last sentence you can keep it for yourself
      May 18
    • Apple castigator
      You call it baby and I don’t. It is even medically not called baby.
      May 18
    • Apple castigator
      Except that when you state “killing babies” you are completely misleading, like many pro-life people. A baby is born (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/baby) and nobody wants to kill a baby.
      May 18
    • Axon axon
      Passing through the birth canal does not change a living human at all.
      May 26
  • Axon axon
    Banning guns makes a human unable to defend himself. Abortion kills humans who cannot defend themselves. Conservatives protect the human life - what is difficult to grasp here?
    May 26 3
    • Google Mr. GIass
      LMAO
      May 27
    • Apple purifier
      Except that guns are used to kill people and fetuses (not humans) are stopped before becoming humans.
      May 27
    • Axon axon
      Human life is human life. What you call a fetus is not a dog, it's absolutely, unmistakably a growing human. Guns are just inanimate tools.
      Jun 3
  • Cisco daniel8
    Murder is illegal because we hold that as a standard for a moral society.
    Abortion should also be illegal because it is akin to murder.
    People still murder though.

    Having a gun doesn't automatically make you a killer, while the act of abortion is the act of murder.

    More stats to argue, but I just wanted to help explain the logic
    May 21 3
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      Manslaughter in self defense is akin to murder too.

      Nuance matters.
      May 21
    • Microsoft 🦍Ape
      OP
      Abortion is not murder by any definition of any law scientific or otherwise
      May 21
    • Axon axon
      It is killing a healthy, innocent human life. How is it not a murder?
      May 26
  • OpenTable Meliodas
    Actually, the argument is that restricting guns only harms lawful citizens engaged in lawful activity. Criminals will still get them. Just as with abortion.

    We see a lot of gun cases citing abortion cases.

    Restricting access to guns is no different than restricting access to abortion, both show a disdain for liberty.
    May 17 1
  • Logitech oXrB48
    I'm guessing they say that for the same reason they say to ban murder. Those idiots.
    May 17 0
  • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
    It's because banning guns affects them while banning abortions doesn't. They just want control. When you restrict abortion you increase the total number of abortions, when abortion is unrestricted, you get less total abortions. If they actually cared about total number of abortions, they would completely legalize it.

    The opposite is true of guns, if you look at any country that has banned guns, you actually do have less gun violence.

    So it's not about facts, it's about control.
    May 26 6
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      And, a corresponding increase in other violence, see Australia as an example.

      Gun control isn’t about facts, it’s about control.
      May 26
    • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
      And England hasn't had a school shooting since 1996
      May 26
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      Perhaps not, but it still has a violence problem that impacts far more people.

      Why the fixation on only one type of violence to the detriment of other types?
      May 26
    • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
      Because kids now have to deal with active shooter drills in school. That's traumatizing. At least with say, a bomb, it's over as soon as it starts. A standard non traumatizing fire or earthquake drill would suffice. I can't think of a type of violence a random person could inflict that would induce as much mass fear as shootings do.
      May 26
    • OpenTable Meliodas
      Try bombings.
      May 26
    • Podium / Eng 🏴‍☠️💾
      I already mentioned that. You're not stuck on lockdown for an hour while the shooter looks for more targets. If you're unharmed from the bomb, you immediately know you're safe.
      May 26
  • US Air Force hardAF
    Great false comparison!!
    One is a service, one is a good. Drugs which are illegal (and a good), you can get them anywhere even order them from the web... trying to hire a hit man, for a face to face meeting which is a service, much much harder to orchestrate. Your idiot-logic is such a false comparison, that you make me regret spending anytime on this app.
    May 24 0
  • Google Ow29qD
    But can't you flip this the other way?

    Where is should the line between bans and live and let live be drawn?
    May 18 1
    • Microsoft 🦍Ape
      OP
      Ban nothing
      May 18
  • New slang
    Basing your politics on what is humane isn't going to give you a "one right way" to live. You could just as easily argue that abortion is inhumane.
    Jun 3 0
  • New / R&D
    wizzzz

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    wizzzzmore
    We need both "sensible gun control" and "sensible abortion control".
    May 31 0

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