CompensationMay 16, 2019
Microsoft————-

Why TC in Europe is laughable?

I wanted to spend a few years working in Europe, where my grandparents came from. After searching around, I found TC there is generally laughable but COL is definitely not low. Why?

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pikachui May 16, 2019

Socialism

GitHub WAwq58 May 16, 2019

🙄 at least enough distant from the gun lovers

Cisco Cheese-Itz May 16, 2019

Gun violence happens most of the time in places where most people dont have guns.

Oracle not_larry May 16, 2019

Same as in Canada.

Akamai Technologies VmQQ44 May 16, 2019

Not only is TC low, taxes are insane. Agree with @pikachui, socialism, not in its most extreme sense but what people call “democratic socialism” which is socialism light. Massive social welfare programs mean massive taxes for employers/employees and everyone suffers. All these idiots espousing democratic socialism point to Scandinavian countries but the truth is individuals from these countries come here and do far better. Most of these countries made all their achievements under capitalism and have started to crumble under socialism lite and unfettered immigration of uneducated/unskilled individuals.

Amazon . 𓂸 May 16, 2019

WTF are you talking about, Scandinavian countries routinely score on the top in terms of development and 'happiness' scores.

Ascension Health goback May 16, 2019

Yeah because they teach them since middle school to be happy through no daylight season and horrible weather. If they can be happy through that, they can be happy through socialism. Anyways, the OP was talking about TC, not happiness. So I dont see why you bring it up.

Microsoft nKKF86 May 16, 2019

Disagree I was just recently on Spain and Portugal for holiday and drove around the country. The streets are super clean, the roads and infrastructure are in great shape (much better than in Seattle) and in ten days I never saw a homeless person or someone begging. You do see people who play guitar or do other things on the street. Go to SFO, NY or Seattle or any big us city and you see tons of garbage and homeless people. It's very simple, in western European countries they have veryarge safety nets with free health care, education, etc. And yes ymtaxes are very high. I'm personally happy to pay higher taxes if it will help people. So, the best deal is to earn in the us and then retire in Europe.

Cisco Cheese-Itz May 16, 2019

Anecdotes are so damn convenient arent they @Microsoft?

Twitter Oomnj May 16, 2019

It’s fun when you’re a tourist. Not fun when you’ve have >20% youth unemployment

Twitter Oomnj May 16, 2019

Socialism dude. There is no desire to rise about mediocrity. The actual value of tech is hence not reflected in salaries since people only view it as another profession. Also the European tech industry is very small compared to US or China mostly due to socialist regulations and culture. They rather spend lazy time on the beach

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BayGirlGo May 16, 2019

This

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martinr May 17, 2019

BS, maybe you’re talking about Spain/Portugal and Greece, but just for you to know - the rest of Europe thinks they only lie on the beach too.

Confluent udTC08 May 16, 2019

All these people saying "socialism" are partially right, but not for the reasons they think. In European countries, you don't need to make such a huge income to maintain a decent standard of living. You don't need massive savings accounts in case you get cancer, for example. So the price that people are willing to exchange for their time and skills can be lower. Then there are market dynamics - not as many tech jobs in Europe => less demand for SWEs => less competition from employers.

Microsoft loans flk May 16, 2019

I think this thread shows how massively uneducated many here are about Europe. Or social systems in general, for that matter.

Microsoft Gojira May 16, 2019

Care to educate us or is putting out an opinion without much substance all you came here for?

Amazon trimlp May 16, 2019

@Gojira +1. Ad hominem arguments are my biggest pet peeves

Apple etubrute May 16, 2019

“You don’t always get what you want...but if you try sometimes you just might find...you get what you need”. This is Europe in a nutshell. They have higher standards of living for 75% of the population compared to the US. Better infrastructure. Affordable education. Paid healthcare. Generous retirement benefits and paid leave. Heavy weight system of checks and balances. But people are more to content with the medium bucks, because of what else they get for their tax dollars. And home ownerships isn’t a major thing there. Most people rent and rent prices are more reasonable. This is why the cost of labor has a tight upper bound. Because you’re not worth more than what they pay. They will find someone else with similar skills to do the work. If you’re a typical middle class worker in the US and in Europe, you’ll find that what is paid for through your tax dollars is quite generous and would require you to earn more money in the states to cover. Add up the costs of things like childcare, healthcare, transportation, college, and eldercare/retirement, pension/retirement income. Europe isn’t that bad of a gig for most people. But for high earning folks like us, the US is better.

Twitter Oomnj May 16, 2019

It just rewards mediocrity. The reason it can do so and tax high is because the US covers their défense

Apple etubrute May 16, 2019

You’re going to have to convince them of that. I doubt you will. And I wouldn’t call the finished goods coming out of Europe mediocre. A sizable chuck of the electronics in an IPhone come from Various countries in Europe. Airbus planes aren’t mediocre compared to Boeing. German cars aren’t mediocre to US cars. Point of fact I prefer most European exports to domestic analogs simply because they’re better. I guess this isn’t what you mean by mediocrity...

Apple net worth May 16, 2019

They are already rich and don’t need to work as hard.

Twitter Oomnj May 16, 2019

Lol that’s not true at all

Apple net worth May 16, 2019

Why? They have affordable health care, education and housing

Kasardia CLQ May 16, 2019

Socialism my friend. The government does the spending for you.

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martinr May 17, 2019

And what’s wrong with that when your tax is the same as in US? And you get healthcare and schools for that. Btw my tax in Switzerland is below 20% on average.