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I have two offers from: Uber Twitch I don’t want to leave my current role because I like my job and i’m also 20-30% in my visa/gc process at Microsoft. For those that know about the process, my PD is current. My competing offers show that i’m being paid really crappy here. I want to “vwmf” but if I knew what to do, i wouldn’t ask here. Is there a way to talk to my manager about my payscale without screwing myself? I really don’t want to move but i also want a raise. Is this the classical “you can’t have both” answer? By Both, I mean: being a visa slave and having higher TC without moving. Current MS TC: 150ish New TC: 245ish Yoe: 1.5 GC process will take another 1.5 years Blind, please advise on the manager part. Do i bring it up? Yes/No? #tech #microsoft #product #help #raise
It's not going to help. 245k is way put of band (assuming L59/L60). The best you'll get, if you have a nice manager, is a promise to help push for a promotion soon ... Which still wouldn't hit 245k anyway
What would you recommend then? Only way I can ask my manager is if i’m ready to leave and i’m not. I want to prioritize my gc. In this case, do i cough up the extra 95k per year for the next 1.5 years as “GC opportunity cost”?
You can’t have your cake and eat it too man. You won’t be able to get the same money at Microsoft and not postpone your GC process. Same thing is happening to a couple friends of mine at Microsoft.
I'm pretty sure if you want to get a raise this way you need to be able to really leave if they say no.
What would you recommend then? Only way I can ask my manager is if i’m ready to leave and i’m not. I want to prioritize my gc. In this case, do i cough up the extra 95k per year for the next 1.5 years as “GC opportunity cost”?
I don't know how switching teams in Microsoft works, but that is another possible idea. If switching teams is trivial as it is in Google, find some internal teams that want you, get offers externally, AND THEN you can tell your manager you want to leave. If he says no to more money you can at least fallback to switching teams without a payrise, I hope.
Get ready to leave if they say No. Don’t worry about GC, as you said 1.5 YOE assuming you still have enough time to file GC. Just make sure Uber/Twitch whatever you choose starts the PERM process asap.
I want to prioritize GC because i want to get my gc asap. If i leave, i restart the Gc process and my timeline at the other company will be 2-4 years depending on how long it’ll take. Currently, it’s taking another 1.5 years for gc. If i switch, it could be 2-4 years depending on the path they take to GC (I am a canadian)
If you're Canadian, why the rush for GC? TN is pretty easy to get, and can be renewed every 3 years afaik.
I think it depends on the relationship with your manager. If you are close and don’t think they will retaliate I think it’s fine to open that discussion and say what you’ve said here: you want to stay but need the $ . But be ready to go elsewhere in case the convo sours.
What would you recommend then? Only way I can ask my manager is if i’m ready to leave and i’m not. I want to prioritize my gc. In this case, do i cough up the extra 95k per year for the next 1.5 years as “GC opportunity cost”?
That compensation level at Microsoft is top of senior band, even lower band of principal, so imposible if you’re < L63. If you are dead-set on getting the GC asap, then you are stuck with Microsoft’s shitty TC… Best you can hope for is a fast track into a promotion, with a good bonus and/or an SSA/SCA, and that’s all under the mercy of your manager. However, I would advice against staying at Microsoft just for the GC for multiple reasons, and assuming getting the GC will take you more than 1 year: 1) It’s harder to switch the longer you wait. 2) the Microsoft stack is not popular outside of MSFT and you’ll have an easier time adapting the sooner you gtfo. 3) the added time on restarting the GC process is probably 6-12 months, at which I would much rather spend earning way more then the current rate, because it’s not just the $ difference, but investment (with the caveat that next stock is still blue chip?)
1.) wouldn’t another 1.5 year of experience at MS make me more employable? So in 1.5 years, i’ll have 3 years of product experience at Microsoft. 2.) i’m in PM so i’m thinking the PM skills are definitely transferrable. No? 3.) the added time will be around 5 months best case, or upwards of 2 years if these companies go from TN->H1B-> GC. Microsoft goes from TC->GC directly…
Sorry I missed the fact that you were a PM. In that case yeah, 1 and 2 are points in favor. 3) might become a function of where you see the other company’s stock land. I think all that considered then you’d be best biting the bullet and staying with a lower pay… potentially try to work out a fast track plan with your manager but I wouldn’t hold my breath thinking they will budge only because you have other offers.
Counteroffers don't work in favor of anybody. Eventually it crumbles just like 90% of everybody else who's tried this in the past.
So you’d advise against talking to my manager about this? And just staying quiet?
You are giving more value to GC than it needs to. Just make a switch and make sure they start the process as soon as you join.
Do u think so? I feel like I am giving it more value too. I just want stability for myself. Thinking what if i join one of these companies and get laid off? I’ll be asked to leave America or find another job in less then 2 months timeframe. That’s the problem. With a GC, i will never have that problem. Thoughts?
If you get laid off and can’t find a work within 2 months, GC won’t help you either. Look at Indians how long they wait in line. Many of them have spouse, kids and even buy house(s) without GC. After i140 is approved, spouse can start work on EAD. So, you don’t really need GC as long as you have some dual intent visa.
It is taking a very long time for perm/GC process anyhow. Make a switch. There is no point sticking with limited amount of RSU at MS
Any update on this OP? Were the offers for PM jobs?
Hey, I decided against both and stayed put at Microsoft.Going to wait for green card since the priority date for my country is current. They just filed my perm so if everything goes smoothly, i might only be looking at another 6 months for PERM to finish + I140 Premium so around 8 months? will likely stay for a month after approved I140 so all in, i think i have another 9 months. Lets say PERM gets audited and what not, probably an extra 5 months so about 14 months all in. I also decided not to bring it up with my manager. I couldn't risk it.
I feel you… I am also on a visa, so thanks for the detailed response. Were the offers for other PM roles? You mentioned that you moved into PM, I was wondering if potentially you also applied to dev roles. I can’t seem to get any PM interviews even with my Msft PM experience
If I had any advice to offer, I would but I don’t have the experience to provide anything insightful- sorry. I am curious though what your title is at Microsoft/Uber/Twitch with that TC. Are you a Senior Product Manager and the competing offers are also SPM roles?
I am a PM2 at MS. I was an internal switch from another role, and I graduated in covid so I barely got any stock. My current tc has very little stock. Most of it is Base + bonus. New TC is base + bonus + stocks. I have a bachelors and total 1.5 yoe
Your salary for 1.5YOE is incredible. The competing offer is unbelievable. Either way you are doing great.