Recruiters asking for pay expectation before onsite. 3 part question. Read below.
I am seeing a lot of recruiters asking for pay expectations prior to interviews recently after the CA law changed that you cannot ask a candidate his or her current salary. 1. Sometimes they wont move forward with the interview process until you give them a number. How do you handle this? I have a target number and it alway seems to come off as too high and they dont move forward with the onsite even though prior to hearing the number they did want to. 2. Also, let's say after a successful onsite I was asked to give a TC number. What does TC ideally include according to the recruiter. There needs to be a standard. For me, its base+yearly cash bonus+yearly RSU vesting value. (No sign on or relocation and other benefits)? 3. Should you instead just talk about base instead? Any negotiation tips/tricks are helpful. Recruiters, feel free to chime in. I dont want to waste my time or yours.
Fucking recruiters in Los Angeles though.. good Lord... ~13-14 years experience, built and led teams, hitting me up for L1-L3 roles with shit comp on a 6mo contract with "possibility of extension" like that's a bonus. Ok, I'll play on this other "director role," but before we schedule on-site, what's your comp expectations? "I would like to learn more about the roles and responsibilities before discussing comp," "oh ok, but I can't do my job if you don't give me a number," "not sure what to tell you, I can't continue this conversation if you can't give me a range," "ok, well, it's between 95-125k year," > Be me... "Aaaand?" " That's the range, still interested?" "Nope, let me know when you're ready to hire someone. Good luck." *Click*
I don't worry so much about options or bonuses, options almost never come through, and when they do, you usually get screwed or frankly the product isn't unique enough to even consider what they worth in a year or two. Most of the time these companies are run by jerks controlled by a board of VCs who have no clue how fucked the product is and subsequently push the c-suite to bargain hunt on Sprint estimates, knowing damn well there isn't enough daylight between now and their arbitrary deadline to accomplish what they're being asked to accomplish. Look, Total Comp in the startup world is really all that matters. Options are a joke, fuck those, exchufor higher pay. Use the extra cash to invest in your 401k, Crypto, or brokerage. Bonuses? Good luck with that. So many companies are offering 10-15% below market with this bullshit 10% carrot at the end of the stick you'll allegedly receive at the end of Q4. Oh, sales sold a product engineering couldn't build in time to hit your sales goals? Sucks to be you, you just worked 60+hr weeks for nothing and your butt plug of a bonus puts you $7k or ~4% under market average leaving you 13k shy of what you probably should have been earning had you got that higher check and got a raise after y1.
I’d try to push salary talks until after onsite. If the recruiter asks you, ask back “What is the range for this role?”. You can always push back with the typical “I’m interested in the job, not the money. We can talk money once I see a fit”. If they insist and don’t want to move forward, probably a good sign and you should pass. I avoid 3rd party recruiters whenever possible.
Tell them you’re not interested in talking about salary until after interviews. If they insist just tell them that is your position
Keep in mind the recruiter has actual very little say over what you will be offered. I'm in management -- the recruiter screens my candidates looking to see if they are even in the ballpark for the budget I have. Example - if I'm hiring at 100k max budget, If someone is asking for 200k i won't interview that person as 100k is my max. If I was you I'd ask myself -- does this always happen to me? If you've had initial screenings with 10 recruiters and 10 didn't move forward with an interview.... you may be pricing yourself out of options.
From your manager perspective, wouldn’t you want to meet with the best candidates, and then negotiate? Yes, budgeting is important, but you could be missing out on someone great that will increase the value of your team by saying I won’t talk to you because you want too much.
What is to negotiate? Someone won’t come down by 50%. Or, if they do, they will be immediately looking for work elsewhere.
Is this in-house or third party recruiter? Sounds really lame if it's in-house.
Your expectations are too high if it is non fang. Just try to go to fang if you want the best comp
1. Good. Don't waste time with candidates or companies that it won't financially work out. Better not to waste time if you have a hard number they're not hitting. If that number was even slightly close they would ask would you settle for X instead. 2. TC is commonly as you stated, Base + Bonus + Yearly stock vest. They might try to get you with those one time payments, but that's understood as not the TC number.