conservatives seem to be going with the line “well the flu kills too, so we should all go back to work and make money for the job creators”. So... essentially, they advocate letting enough people get infected that the virus bounces around populations for a while and fades away or a vaccine is developed and manufactured... either way... more than a year. But if it’s “only a flu” and our “only” option is to keep things running and let hundreds of thousands die worldwide... what would happen if it was a higher death rate or killed children and old people? Would they suddenly come up with new options or would they tell people to let their kids die of plague so that Nike could still make a buck?
IT IS NOT FLU!!!
Ok, what is the relevance to the discussion?
Commies forget that job creators create jobs for people who are not job creators. People who are not job creators have bills to pay as well. We can’t all live in a perfect socialist co-op where all our needs are taken care of for us.
“Commies forget that job creators create jobs for people who are not job creators. People who are not job creators have bills to pay as well. We can’t all live in a perfect socialist co-op where all our needs are taken care of for us. “ - the guy/girl who can probably work from home
Yea, so?
Nothing
This is a dress rehearsal for a virus that IMO is going to be worse. In a way, although this is far from over, this needed to happen to wake the world up, to what many scientists having being saying will happen, for a long time now. People have freaked with an estimated death rate of around let’s say 4%. Can you imagine if it was 50-70% combined with this infectious rate?
It’s less than 4% for symptomatic, tested cases. Probably 1%-ish or even less overall. Still worse than flu, still more contagious, still a big problem, but to ignore the damage done by shutting down the country is as silly as saying that it’s just the flu. At some point, there is an inflection where a longer shutdown is doing more long-term harm than good. Ascertaining that point is basically going to be educated guesswork, but clearly with a more deadly disease it would be later and with a less deadly disease it would be sooner.
Not sure viruses really work that way, higher the death rate lowers the spread rate. Not saying a worse virus could ever happen but statistically it's a pretty rare chance even one x2 as bad as this ever happens let alone x10-15. Already this is a once in a hundred year event and people are paranoid they will see something much worse much sooner.
It will erase humanity. We’ll barely survive this one...
1. Covid will help us prioritize building the infra needed for a worse pandemic later. That's good. 2. There is little discussion on the cost effectiveness of our current measures. Even if you only care about lives at any cost, the economic harm from what we are doing now will drive "deaths of despair" later. 3. What really worries me is the evil that people can do. In the past hard economic times have contributed to the rise of Hitler, Stalin, and other really bad stuff. Staying really far away from that sounds great.
Fwiw, the first two are worthwhile points on their own. 3 is mostly me in a tinfoil hat. I wouldn't expect most people to agree, nor do I have good data backing that opinion up.
Everyone dies. This is good for earth and universe altogether
Why not lead by example?
Give me a more deadly virus first . Plus you won’t follow my example will you?
If there's no vaccine nor cure for a more deadly virus for more than a year, many many people are going to die anyway, no matter if they stay at home or not. Either because of the virus, or because of a collapsed economy.
So you take a fake "it's just the flu" meme, ignore context, ignore actions taken, add strawmen, and extrapolate it as only behavior to push your snake oil. Do you have an ounce of intellectual honesty? For example, Republicans have a COVID task force, enacted defense act to focus production and cancelled their vacations (and weekends) to come up with financial relief for working class Americans (under $90000/year). Who blocked it? Pelosi, because she wants to cram diversity, green energy funds, election interference and other unrelated goodies. Never forget how Pelosi and Schumer put pandering politics over the working class.
Oooh, management suddenly cares about the workers! Spare me your crocodile tears for working people when you are against raising wages, against public healthcare, against unions etc. No neither party gives a shit about workers. They are trying to save business and are willing to let people die for the stock market. The pandemic exposes how most people are a paycheck or two away from financial ruin already. The difference is that when financial ruin hits a worker because of an unexpected non-contagious disease, a car accident, or lay-offs... you say “well they are just lazy and need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.”
What? I don't fit your mental image of "the evil monopoly man" again? This is one thing that you will never get, given your ideology. You want a burdensome system that is straining all the time just in case that one in a million event happens. What you see Republicans are doing, is they see what is happening and adjust their behavior to fix a real crisis instead of pondering "whether it is socialism or capitalism". You're too rigid. You build strawmen, because you claim to know exactly what your opponent is thinking, despite any evidence to the contrary. You do not accept that you are wrong. Please tell me how Italy and Spain are doing with all their social nets. The reason I am against all your social pet projects because they're shown not to work. Social healthcare is shown to cause more deaths (we discussed Canadian example in peaceful times). Unions become inefficient protection racket, forcing everyone to be same. Raising wages have to follow supply and demand or they are shown to raise cost of living (making the rise pointless).
What happens if your side got it’s open borders and we couldn’t do lockdowns?
Lol, do you think “open borders” is like literally some unlocked gate somewhere? Open borders just means that we don’t have policies restricting who can move based on how rich they are or what region they are from.
Open borders means government needs probable cause to deny someone the right to travel. Big government statists don’t want open borders.