So many threads going on with Amazon guys sending misinformation that FB PIPs same as Amazon. Even though the number of PIP thread by any FB employee is a rare post. I was a Sr. Manager at Amazon for 6 years and M2 at FB for last 2 years. FB PIP is nowhere closer to Amazon. At FB, with most of the performance issues, it is more common to leave voluntarily than going through the PIP. At my VP level, the numbers for PIP were between 1-2%. Some of the key differences between PIP at both the places are - PIP Quota - FB has no quota to PIP. In last 2 years, in 30+ org, I only had 1 PIP and that person decided to leave voluntarily. Amazon was much higher every year on similar size org. - PIP is considered as a positive event at Amazon as it helps everyone till VP to meet goal. It puts incentive for Managers/Directors to PIP people. People at Amazon congratulated me on my first PIP. One of my mentee at Amazon was not give a Top Tier Rating because he has not pipped anyone in 1.5 years. At FB, this is considered as an unfortunate event. - Time to PIP - At Amazon, for every new hire, managers get a 90 day survey to evaluate performance. Any dip in performance, and HR/Director will start asking why we are not putting this person on PIP as early as 90 days. I have seen plenty at Amazon where they were put on pip within 6 months. At FB, 2 months are just bootcamp time, and next 3-4 months are considered as onboarding time. The conversation to PIP really starts around 9-12 month period at FB. - Onboarding expectations - It is widely accepted at FB that onboarding is hard. FB focus on asking people to build fundamentals before they start running. The first 6 months are generally focused on that. Amazon expectation is that you need to start performing like your peers within 90 days. Amazon also has something called as Dev Plan where performance issues are identified. FB has Meets-Most rating which you can consider it similar. The differences are - - Team change - Amazon does not allow you to change team. At FB, you are allowed to change team with 1 MM. You sometimes get stuck in a wrong team or rubbed people in the wrong way. It is better to change team in such situation. - Leaves - Amazon does not allow you to take any extended leaves unless there is a medical reason. At FB, a lot of people take extended leaves (3-6 months) after performance issues. - Next steps timing - At Amazon Dev plan, there is a constant performance discussion and documentation, and it can lead to PIP in next 60 days. At FB, you need to wait for next performance cycle (6 months) and if the rating continues, then PIP discussion happens. It is not expected that people can turn around performance issues within 60 days. People are confusing burnouts and PIP. FB burnouts I agree would be a similar level as Amazon. But FB burnouts are because of chasing promotion and bonus. At FB, the rewards are 300% target for top ratings. Also many people climb the promotion ladder very fast (almost 1 promotion every year). This causes a lot of burnout. Amazon burnout are mainly because of PIP/Dev plans and Oncalls. TC - 900K
How about google?
Polluted by ex-Amazon managers. Very predictable culture change.
Avoid freshly minted ex Amazon managers, otherwise good.
This is awesome OP, thanks for sharing your insights 👏
FB has a forced % MM rating which let’s be honest leads exactly to the same thing. At fb people leave voluntarily because it is easier for them to do so, there is the extended 6 month time window to interview, the fb name brand which is tiers above amazons, and in general fb hires smarter people who are more capable to leave anyway. Whether someone leaves “voluntarily” due to getting a MM rating or is forced to leave, both are forced % which might not occur naturally, both out people through hell. The whole purpose of the forced pip % or forced MM % are to pit people against each other to work harder and for managers to have something to fight over for the constant political game of thrones. FB and amzn are two separate hoodies, but cut from the same cloth.
Can you please explain what MM is? Never heard of it before
MM means meets most, and then there is MA which is Meets All. 2 MMs in a row, and you are looking at PIP. But since perf reviews are every 6 months, people have plenty time to recover.
This is a top tier post 👏
Thanks for the insight. Going through final round for both Meta and Amazon right now, and this makes the decision a bit easier if money is roughly equal.
Thanks for putting this up.
This is exactly the kind of high quality content that Blind community needs. Thank you OP!
🍿
Great post
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I agree PIP should be viewed as a failure for the manager and the company and should not be viewed in a positive light.
No it should be viewed as neutral. Viewing it as positive or negative has consequences. There's nothing wrong behind the idea.