Tech IndustrySep 17, 2022
PayPal🦁denseHair

As an engineer do you think is it possible to build a system that doesn’t need sev-0 on call?

Let’s just consider about backend systems that serves WEB and mobile requests. In 2022, we can do auto scale up and down with current technology. For migrations and stuff we need engineers as back and those are not sev-0. Do you think we can build systems that doesn’t require on call? I’m not talking about complex services or systems that supports spaceX kind of shit. Just a normal web app like Zillow serving data from DB via BE micro services to web and mobile requests. I’m not including ML services like recommendation engines etc. #tech

New
aaQF04 Sep 17, 2022

Yes

Sonder whitetigre Sep 17, 2022

Trivial systems maybe, but bugs are unpredictable.

PayPal 🦁denseHair OP Sep 17, 2022

That means the team didn’t do TDD and QA wasn’t great enough.

Sonder whitetigre Sep 17, 2022

If a system reaches a certain level of complexity (and the bar isn't that high) no test suite can cover all combinations.

New
aaQF04 Sep 17, 2022

Automotive ECUs are very complicated systems that are designed to never need external input/debugging

Sonder whitetigre Sep 17, 2022

Easy to test though due to very well-defined input ranges. And there's a shit ton of ECU-related vehicle recalls, some of them high profile.

Amazon anon?? Sep 17, 2022

Possible? Yes. Practical? No. There are trade offs you have to make in the real world, especially with respect to time.

Airbnb LC Monkey Sep 17, 2022

More iterations more chances to bugs, stop dev and you will make it super robust very soon

New
Aqul77 Sep 17, 2022

of course it is possible. just not at a cost you can afford

Amazon bry47 Sep 17, 2022

As soon as you start adding features, it would start needing an oncall.

Oracle fy56hf Sep 17, 2022

I know of a system that doesn't have constant OnCall for developers. They have operations folks that I think do have OnCall but they can only restart services or do other basic things, can't fix actual bugs. Business critical enterprise software, they have SLAs and refund clauses. But no 24/7 OnCall for devs

Microsoft ♥️shaped📦 Sep 17, 2022

The more complex the system gets the more likely it will break in some spectacular way. Best case you will need someone to soothe a big user panicking over misinterpreting some metric or forgetting to do something they need to do

New
UyFh71 Sep 17, 2022

Even spaceships blow up. Your web system can go down any time for an unprecedented cause.